Mountain West To Be 12 Team League Within 24-48 Hours
by Jeremy Mauss on Jan 24, 2011 3:45 PM PST
in Conference Expansion
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PrintThere are a lot reports going out today about what will go in within the Mountain West meetings that will be taking place this evening, so anything that has been mentioned is all speculation and not official. At this time Salt Lake Tribune Utah State beat writer Tony Jones is on 1280 The Zone in Salt Lake and talked about how the Mountain West deal to add two Mountain West teams is not a done deal. Even though he seems confident a decision will be made within 48 hours and the only teams mentioned were Utah State and San Jose State.
It is all coming together and it seems that Comcast is using their influence to add Utah State and San Jose State. Tonight Comcast will present a proposal to the league and a decision could be made sometime tomorrow. They really want to keep the Salt Lake market by inviting Utah State, and yes the share would be less then having BYU and Utah, but the Utah market has been a big deal for Comcast and they want to keep ties in Utah.
The Bay Area discussion has been talked about here with the potential add of San Jose State to the Mountain West that started gaining traction last week. We have all heard that the San Jose market in Northern California is the sixth in the nation, but San Jose State football is miles behind Stanford, Cal and most likely any other big game on television. Potential must be thrown out with these two teams since neither will provide a major boost to the television deal outside of what market they are in, but the idea of having the potential of each market size is enticing for Comcast.
The two additions is obviously a money grab for a title game which will bring in extra cash which has been rumored to be anywhere from $3 to $7 million per year. So basically what we know is that nothing has happend and that Comcast is pulling the strings, as expected.
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Guess they are giving up their BCS hopes...
maybe it’ll work out in the end and they can do the joint BCS bid with CUSA and hopefully both get AQ bids in a few years…..
CUSA vs Mtn West.........
a “play-in” game would bring additional TV revenues to both conferences. Any team going through their entire conference season along with a CCG and a “play-in” game undefeated would be BCS qualified IMO. The bigger question still is whether the AQ will open the door???
by Chris Holly Taylor on Jan 24, 2011 4:18 PM PST up reply actions
good points
However, C-USA has more to gain then the MWC. The MWC champ has gotten in the past three years but also have been undefeated in the process.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Jan 24, 2011 4:26 PM PST up reply actions
Yeah, but the MWC champ was Utah or TCU
And they’re not MWC Ttams anymore. Boise State will be a good standard bearer, but sadly the shine of an undefeated MWC season won’t carry the national prestige it did even this past season. Amazingly, it looks like the C-USA play-in AQ game idea that was floated by Thomson/Banowsky is now the only way the MWC ever gets even a semblance of an AQ.
I liked the Hawaii football only add- not crazy about SJSU and USU but there weren’t any options left for 12.
Axes Up. Miner Rush - For UTEP Miners Fans
that would mean 15 games with bcs game and 15 games for the loser of the play in game
i don’t think anybody has gone 15-0 in a season? byu once was 14-1 in the 16 team wac conference and they played in the kickoff classic, beat wyoming in wac cg and then beat kansas state in cotton bowl. qb was steve sarkisian who is now head coach of the washington huskies. i think i got that right.
On february 5th 2011 at UFC 126 Jon "Bones" Jones will show the world that their was no need for the MMA community to hype this man because this guy is a beast with many skills and i personally will feel Ryan "Darth" Bader's pain after this fight. SB Nation's public enemy #1.
by wolfmanshowlforever on Jan 25, 2011 12:17 AM PST up reply actions
Let the B-ball only member speculation commence!
I’ll start it off with a bang: Texas goes indy with all other sports to the MWC!
ha!
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by Jeremy Mauss on Jan 24, 2011 4:01 PM PST up reply actions
I'd take the Zags as well
but I have a feeling they are very content in the WCC.
I’ll throw out another name: Cal State Fullerton. Basketball program is not great but the MWC would get a nationally ranked baseball program.
Their travel expenses would go up exponentially, though.
Those nine California Big West schools have a pretty sweet deal in terms of travel.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Jan 24, 2011 8:16 PM PST up reply actions
They already fly to most games...
unlike the bus leaguers, so the MWC wouldn’t be that big of a difference plus like Smoove V said their money would go up…
BYU
would be a logical choice for all sports except football. Plus BYU could still be a great out of conference football game for many of the Mtn West members. The only question is whether or not the bridge has been burnt already.
by Chris Holly Taylor on Jan 24, 2011 4:51 PM PST up reply actions
Those last three
Bring zero to the conference… Gonzaga is really the way to go.
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UNLV is going to have 4 losses this year!
The Suns are going to be 61-21 in the regular season this year!
;)
Twitter: @rebelfan1_
I think it should be BYU or Gonzaga, leaving the WCC at eight members.
Getting either one of the two would be a real coup at this point.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Jan 24, 2011 8:17 PM PST up reply actions
Another plus for Gonzaga to join the MWC
Stronger conference schedule. When you’re facing SDSU, UNLV, New Mexico and now CSU, you won’t have to schedule something like 8 ranked teams in the non-conference.
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Bright Side of the Sun - Dedicated to Phoenix Suns basketball since 2006.
UNLV is going to have 4 losses this year!
The Suns are going to be 61-21 in the regular season this year!
;)
Twitter: @rebelfan1_
Good point.
Plus, their travel isn’t so great in the WCC anyway.
But the biggest factor of all is probably money, and they’ll get more by being a member of a 12-team football conference than they do in an 8-9 team WCC.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Jan 25, 2011 10:05 AM PST up reply actions
20 conference games
Top 8 seeds make the conference tournament.
No 12th team.
Go Nevada Wolf Pack!
by BacksThePack on Jan 24, 2011 4:06 PM PST up reply actions
Sun Belt needs to move quickly
and add New Mexico St, Texas St, UTSA, and LA Tech to become a 14 team conference like the MAC will be after they add UMass…….
Divisions would be
West NM St, UTSA, TX St, N TX, LA Tech, ULM, ULL
East Ark St, W Kent, MTSU, Troy, S Bama, FAU, FIU
They have
South Alabama coming on soon for football.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Jan 24, 2011 4:27 PM PST up reply actions
appalachian state is deciding right now whether to go to fbs. wonder where they land if they do it?
On february 5th 2011 at UFC 126 Jon "Bones" Jones will show the world that their was no need for the MMA community to hype this man because this guy is a beast with many skills and i personally will feel Ryan "Darth" Bader's pain after this fight. SB Nation's public enemy #1.
by wolfmanshowlforever on Jan 24, 2011 10:53 PM PST up reply actions
No financial penalties...as far as I know...
The WAC could also be disbanded if everyone but Denver jumps ship…
if that is the case
then next year could be interesting with a 13 team MWC.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Jan 25, 2011 9:23 AM PST up reply actions
I don't know
If they really want to deal with 14 teams before we see how that works out for the MAC… Also, as long as LA Tech’s been dealing with WAC travel, why would they swallow their pride and join the Sun Belt now? They seem to still be holding out for the Big East to poach Memphis or UCF (since UTEP doesn’t seem to be going anywhere now) so they can get a CUSA invite. I do think the Sun Belt should go ahead and snag Texas State and UTSA so they’ll be at 12 teams and divisions by 2014.
by commodore_dude on Jan 25, 2011 6:52 AM PST up reply actions
LA Tech would have some balls if they turned down any fb playing conference...
the WAC is a sinking ship why would they stay and travel to Idaho, Denver, and possibly Utah Valley or Seattle for non revenue sports when they could be playing teams in their surrounding states…they may have to swallow their pride but if the SB doesn offer Texas St and UTSA, the only fb playing members left in the WAC would be Idaho, NM St, and LA Tech…so I highly doubt they’d turn away the MAC at this point and time…
As far as going to 14, there is just more security in numbers, if 1 or 2 get poached by CUSA then they are still okay, also 14 would idealy mean (however not realistically) the champ was more battle tested (in their conference) than a 12 team conference (which also means less OOC losses) plus with the MAC and SB being percieved as weeker conferences they may be able to get a joint BCS bid (way down the road after the MWC/CUSA have had one for years) by simply having more teams in competition.
tentatively, yes...
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by notsellingjeans on Jan 24, 2011 8:18 PM PST up reply actions
IF this really happens......
when will the realignment be implemented? IF the WAC could be disolved as of June 30, 2011 by a vote of its membership. IF the Mtn West would release TCU to go to the Big East on July 1, 2011 (I know bad for AQ purposes). IF there are no further defections from the Mtn West. The “new” Mtn West could kick-off starting July 1, 2011.
by Chris Holly Taylor on Jan 24, 2011 4:38 PM PST reply actions
good question
No idea, but that has been talked about. Possibly a 13 team league for a year?
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by Jeremy Mauss on Jan 24, 2011 4:47 PM PST up reply actions
MAC already does it with 13 teams, two uneven divisions
Ron Washington...giving hope everywhere to the kids who eat lead paint chips of being a big league manager when they grow up since 2007.
one year
would be fine. Just play the conference title game at the home of the better team.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Jan 25, 2011 9:24 AM PST up reply actions
San Jose State?
I’m sure that will help in the SFB area, what with there ability to deliver literally – what? – several thousand viewers? The conference is going to get diluted for that? Maybe Rice can get convinced to jump so the MWC can get into the Houston market.
We want to build a university our football team can be proud of. -- Dr. George Lynn Cross
Adding Utah State isn't all that bad.
USU has a Top 25 basketball program (as of this week) and there football program was one win away from a bowl game. If USU can just make it over the hump to a bowl game for a few years in a row, that program could get traction and get out of the dump. Not only that, but USU is also looking to expand their stadium.
SJSU on the other hand is in the dumps in both programs. As TowerPower stated in another thread, the only good reason to add SJSU is the San Jose market. It doesn’t matter if no one is watching the games, but they are still paying for the channel anyways. Plus there is also the upside of having three california schools, all in major markets. They could easily develop some nice rivalries there, especially with SDSU and Fresno State having good football teams and big fanbases.
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Bright Side of the Sun - Dedicated to Phoenix Suns basketball since 2006.
UNLV is going to have 4 losses this year!
The Suns are going to be 61-21 in the regular season this year!
;)
Twitter: @rebelfan1_
USU basketball is nothing until they win a NCAA game
Until then, they are a bloated team fed by too many cupcakes and an unwillingness to play anybody outside of Utah
Go Nevada Wolf Pack!
by BacksThePack on Jan 24, 2011 7:53 PM PST up reply actions
good points
I agree they schedule soft which hurt them in seeding or getting into the NCAA tournament that one year when they were ranked and left out.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Jan 25, 2011 9:26 AM PST up reply actions
Utah State would be better if we still have BYU or Utah
But at least they are decent at basketball and good for an easy win in football. SJSU on the other hand, brings zero to the table in all aspects.
Show me a good loser, and I'll show you a loser. -- Vince Lombardi
by Sam (sdsuaztec4) on Jan 24, 2011 6:42 PM PST reply actions
The only reason SJSU is even considered
Is because our only real options are Idaho and SJSU. Both have horrible programs, but SJSU has the San Jose market while Idaho has nothing else to offer other than an easy win.
Mountain West Connection - All you need to know about the Mountain West and then some.
Stampede Blue - An Indianapolis Colts blog.
Bright Side of the Sun - Dedicated to Phoenix Suns basketball since 2006.
UNLV is going to have 4 losses this year!
The Suns are going to be 61-21 in the regular season this year!
;)
Twitter: @rebelfan1_
I understand
But I’m not convinced that they have to move on this now. Why not wait to see if BYU decides it wants to be in a conference again? The money from the TV deal and the championship game better be worth dividing up the money between another two teams.
We want to build a university our football team can be proud of. -- Dr. George Lynn Cross
easy money
Getting 12 teams provide the easy money for a title game.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Jan 24, 2011 7:27 PM PST up reply actions
And the potential of disbanding the WAC immediately
Which saves the exit fees for the newcomers.
The Oakland A's: If you have a no-trade clause in your contract, we're in it.
by notsellingjeans on Jan 24, 2011 8:21 PM PST up reply actions
I get that
But let’s say that the current revenue divided up among ten teams is $100, and it is divided up evenly. If you add two teams, then you have to make $20 more for it to make economic sense to the original ten teams. Will it? If the conference didn’t expand now, but waited, say, three years to see if BYU will come back, how much will have been lost? Might it be worth it to continue efforts to add one or two Texas teams? I just don’t see the danger in moving with circumspection at this time.
We want to build a university our football team can be proud of. -- Dr. George Lynn Cross
that extra $20 could be...
the CCG, the extra OOC game from playing 8 instead of 9 games, decreased travel cost (excluding Hawaii), and the high likelihood of the new TV contract negotiation with the 9 team swing (minus 3, plus 6)…tons of possibilities that I assume someone smarter than me has already crunched the number and decided it was worth it.
Or they might over value the CG and lose money
Also, reducing conference games from 9 to 8 can be done without expansion. MWC and WAC already play a fair number of games with each other because of the close proximity. Unless the danger is that USU and SJSU might drop football if they don’t join the MWC, thus reducing the number of FBS teams in the region.
As far as the best and the brightest adding up the numbers and it worked out great, the best and the brightest also said that about credit default swaps and look how that turned out.
We want to build a university our football team can be proud of. -- Dr. George Lynn Cross
Well, C-USA
just signed a deal with Fox and CBS College Sports for $14mm, or $1.2 million/school. Right now each MWC school gets $1.4 mm from The Mtn deal. According to my back of the envelope calculations, a $17.0 mm TV deal would make expansion, at the very least, a break even proposition.
Is an expanded MWC worth at least $3mm more then C-USA? I think so because the #5 Dallas-Fort Worth TV market gets swapped for the #6 Bay Area market. Adding Utah State keeps the SLC market, plus the MWC gains the Boise, Reno, Fresno, and Honolulu markets plus a CCG.
Perhaps more importantly, expansion decimates the WAC to the point where the MWC and the Pac 12 the only viable programing options in the Mountain/Pacific time slots.
+1
Perhaps more importantly, expansion decimates the WAC to the point where the MWC and the Pac 12 the only viable programing options in the Mountain/Pacific time slots.
Those late night Hawaii/Boise St games now are worth twice as much, and you know, if they can reopen the TV deal to negotiations, ESPN will want in on it, the Boise St/Nevada game was a blockbuster for them…
The MWC will also have to submit to playing at least 1 weeknight game Tues/Wed/Fri if they want to get a good contract in the future…
too bad Comcast won't
reopen the deal. ESPN can’t get in until the deals expire, but even then Comcast will have an option to negotiate exclusively (the norm) to resign the MWC.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Jan 25, 2011 9:27 AM PST up reply actions
And the death of the WAC means the MWC can stop looking over its shoulder.
The PAC-10 will want to expand via Texas/Oklahoma schools, if that ever happens. The Big 12 is not likely to expand by picking up MWC teams. (I think that Texas is getting their TV network running before pursuing PAC-10 membership.) None of the conferences further east than the Big 12 would have any interest in scavenging MWC teams. But the only way the WAC was going to expand was to either invite upgrading FCS teams (of which there are very few candidates in the west) or to try to poach off the MWC again.
Killing the WAC gives the MWC as much peace of mind as they can reasonably hope to have.
by David Hooper on Jan 25, 2011 5:58 AM PST up reply actions
I generally agree with you about being reasonably safe but...
New Mexico, Nevada/UNLV could be targeted for in a PAC16 scenario but a ton of things would have to improve, and Air Force is a target school for the Big 12 North along with BYU (and Arkansas and ND) however generally you’re right, worst case scenario they replace three which could be done with the remaining WAC (Idaho, NM St), FCS upgrades (Montana, Cal Poly, ect…), the Texas stranglers from CUSA (assuming they get ravaged by other conferences going to 16 too), or even the Big 12 left overs.
Pac-16
Would likely only encompass 4 Big 12 schools – there’s just nobody else west of the Mississippi with the brand recognition that’s going anywhere. BYU, Air Force and Memphis seem the most likely candidates for the Big 12 to go back to 12, the first two for name and attendance and the last for all that Fedex cash that is allegedly on the table for whoever takes Memphis…
by commodore_dude on Jan 25, 2011 6:56 AM PST up reply actions
true
Unless those three schools mentioned become powers, but a Pac-16 would probably want Texas and Texas A&M. If they get those two then the other two could be really anyone from Oklahoma, Oklahoma State, BYU or even Boise State if they were willing to compromise some stuff to get good teams.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Jan 25, 2011 7:14 AM PST up reply actions
I just don't think
BYU will ever have enough support from Stanford, Cal, etc. to get an invite, no matter what they do. I don’t agree with it, but there you go. If super conferences happen, I’d expect two Big 12 schools to come to the SEC, most likely A&M and Oklahoma State (since Oklahoma wants to stick with Texas). Figure Texas, Oklahoma, and then two of Texas Tech, Kansas and Kansas State (like BYU, I don’t think Baylor will get an invite, no matter what the TX legislature does).
I actually sat down and drew up a superconference plan yesterday with the talk about how Texas’ network could lead to that… and I think the MWC could end up in a good position there, taking in what’s left of the Big 12…
by commodore_dude on Jan 25, 2011 7:25 AM PST up reply actions
Agreed about Texas, Oklahoma, A&M, and Texas Tech.
I think that Ok State would want to stick with Oklahoma instead of heading to the SEC.
That would leave Kansas and K-State, who would most likely end up with the Big East. Or, in a Hail Mary chance, end up in the MWC if there was room. (I just don’t see it happening.)
by David Hooper on Jan 25, 2011 7:30 AM PST up reply actions
You are correct on OU/Okie St...
their higherups are all intermixed ask Redhawk about this sometime…no way they leave each other.
A&M can’t leave without approval from the state legislature which has more UT, Baylor, Tech alums to out vote any Aggie to SEC supporters.
If they go anywhere it’ll be the PAC16 with Texas, A&M, OU, and Okie St. Also remember the remaining North schools (KU, K St, Mizzuou, and Iowa St) had an agreement to join the Big East all together. So that only leave Texas Tech and Baylor who could join either the MWC or CUSA…but also remember the Tech problem, for A&M and UT to leave they would have to get enough votes from the legislature to leave Baylor and Tech and the only way I see that happening is if the UT/A&M alums get the UH/SMU/Rice/UTEP alums to vote with them so that Tech and Baylor join CUSA…I don’t see any way they could join the MWC….
Also if it happens in the near future...
Texas and A&M could “bribe” Tech and Houston who are now both public tier 1 institutions which is a requirement to get added into the state’s oil & gas subsidy money that they currently UT/A&M have a monopoly over, by attaching an amendement to add them in a conference realignment bill maybe that could solve the ‘Tech problem’.
That's partly why I could see A&M going to the SEC.
While the other alums might not normally want that to happen, sending A&M to the PAC would leave Tech out in the cold, and the Tech alums wouldn’t go along with that. I think they’d support A&M to the SEC in exchange for A&M support for Tech to the PAC.
Additionally, if an SEC deal were to be financially beneficial to A&M, it’ll be tough PR sledding for the other schools to deny them that opportunity. It’s Texas and anything’s certainly possible (see: Baylor from the SWC to the Big 12), but that really would not sell well. Besides, the state of Texas would love to be involved in both the SEC and the PAC-whatever.
by David Hooper on Jan 25, 2011 1:10 PM PST up reply actions
But I also agree that Baylor is screwed.
They’ll be hoping that the SEC is willing to package them up with A&M.
by David Hooper on Jan 25, 2011 7:31 AM PST up reply actions
Baylor to the Sun Belt ;)
Go Nevada Wolf Pack!
by BacksThePack on Jan 25, 2011 9:32 AM PST up reply actions
My understanding is that UNM, UNLV, and UNR don't fit the PAC's academic mold.
Texas and Oklahoma do fit very nicely, and if they go I think that OK State and Texas Tech go with them.
There’s no such thing as truly safe, as we’re both apparently conceding, but I don’t see the PAC changing their requirements for inclusion in order to get any of the current/future MWC schools – especially since it takes a unanimous vote for a new school to be added.
by David Hooper on Jan 25, 2011 7:28 AM PST up reply actions
agree with all of that which is why I said...
a ton of things would have to improve
The biggest worry/threat that came out this morning is the A&M to SEC stuff again, while I don’t think it’ll happen, if it did I could see the Big 12 adding BYU and Air Force to the North and New Mexico to the South…remember they don’t want anymore Texas teams so that makes the most sense market wise while attempting to balance out the divisions.
Well Nevada has the best academics of any non-AQ school in the west now, so unless they pull solely Big XII schools, I think Nevada is in the best position. At least until the WAC calls up UC Davis.
Go Nevada Wolf Pack!
by BacksThePack on Jan 25, 2011 9:34 AM PST up reply actions
moscow idaho has been insulted. lol.
On february 5th 2011 at UFC 126 Jon "Bones" Jones will show the world that their was no need for the MMA community to hype this man because this guy is a beast with many skills and i personally will feel Ryan "Darth" Bader's pain after this fight. SB Nation's public enemy #1.
by wolfmanshowlforever on Jan 24, 2011 10:56 PM PST up reply actions
I wonder if the MWC knows that they can't get an autobid straight-up.
With TCU, BYU, and Utah leaving, the BCS types probably have enough leverage to not give the MWC an autobid exemption. If they know that it won’t happen, then there’s really no reason to continue playing conference membership games to try for it. That would leave the C-USA fallback bid.
If that bid is happening, I really see no reason that adding teams to 12 would hurt it. Even if they ended up adding Idaho and SJSU and not adding USU (just to make a worst-case scenario, conference strength-wise), the autobid exemption is a matter of the top team between two conference champions, and that’s really unaffected by the bottom end of a conference.
So as far as autobid considerations are concerned, I don’t see how expansion to 12 necessarily hurts the MWC. It’s a little disappointing to see expansion dictated by Comcast, but if it helps the overall revenue stream, I can’t see a good enough reason to turn down the offer either.
by David Hooper on Jan 24, 2011 7:05 PM PST reply actions 1 recs
they know the auto bid is gone
So that is probably why the no interest from UTEP, SMU or Houston.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Jan 24, 2011 7:35 PM PST up reply actions
Thats the conclusion I came too after TCU left...
the AQ bid needed an exemption and with TCU AND Boise St we may have got it however after losing the “Big 3” I don’t see any way the MW could convince the BCS that they deserve a bid after losing teams. Adding teams to get to 12 not only stabilizes the conference (while killing the WAC +1) but also gives the conference much needed cash from a CCG. This may also allow the MW to get out of there TV contract with losing 3 teams and adding 6, and do thing joint BCS bid with CUSA (which the NCAA has to approve as an exhibition game 1st, then get the joint AQ from the BCS 2nd).
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