My thoughts on BYU's departure
Well BYU, you did it. In the process of chasing the coattails of your rival you have gone independent and left a trail of destruction of not one, but two conferences in your wake. You spent the last 10 years building the Mountain West Conference into what is today, and just when we were on the brink of completion, and possibly doing something very special you set fire to the building and ran.
I'm not sure what you think will be gained by this move. Sure you will get a little more money and you will play some games on the "Evil Four-Letter" and you can show off your sweet HD studio that nobody cares about, but besides that what will this accomplish? All of your sports are now vanquished to the WCC, actually check that, the WCC doesn't even have all of your sports so I'm sure those student-athletes and coaches are thrilled right now. Also just because ESPN seems like the green grass right now remember that you agreed to the creation of The Mtn so we could escape that contract and all of the weeknight games that came with it.
What will your football team play for now? You won't be playing for conference championships, national championships, or even BCS berths. In my estimation your team now plays on for "televangelism" (thanks Hooper) and nothing more. You will play a myriad schedule of complete jokes from the WAC for an easy "W" and just enough legitimate programs to get you to 3-4 losses each year thus remaining completely irrelevant on a national level. To quote the great TCU Head Coach Gary Patterson:
"If you are BYU, you have to be careful what you wish for."
Fans in this conference have long bit their tongue and been respectful to you but all of that ends today, and from now on you will truly feel the hate. BYU has one of the most obnoxious fan-bases around, and it has nothing to do with your religious preferences and everything to do with the disrespectful and arrogant way you carry yourself as a whole. Again I am talking about "BYU football fans" not the Mormon's as a whole.
This goes back all the way to the WAC days when I was a child at a WAC Championship game in Las Vegas and a group of BYU fans sat behind my family in the Air Force section and were so verbally abusive that my grandfather asked them to stop, to which they disrespectfully declined and even amped it up a bit to the point where we had to leave so my grandfather wouldn't get arrested.
I partially feel bad for you all because I think that it's mostly that you are all just socially inept, much like a kid who has been home-schooled his whole life, but that is really no excuse for the way I have seen many BYU fans carry themselves towards "outsiders." If you thought Rice-Eccles was hostile I recommend you star far away from Amon Carter Stadium on October 16th because you will need much more than a beer poncho on the night that the Frogs stomp a mud-hole in your shiny new quarterback.
Now I am starting to ramble so I will close with this, goodbye and good riddance BYU, I hope you enjoy your short trip to everlasting college football obscurity.
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My Thought's Exactly.....
Well said. I hope both the MWC schools and the WAC schools boycott BYU by not scheduling them for future games. This year is going to be interesting as they make their farewell tour throught the MWC. Hate is a harsh word, but I will say that many New Mexico fans, including myself, really, really, really despise BYWho gives a sh*t. Good bye and good riddance!!
Agreed!
BYU may not even have the WAC as a option to play football with even thought I hear they have come up with some kind of agreement. With the MWC at 10 schools I see them adding 2 more and both from CUSA-West (Houston, Tulsa, UTEP, SMU or Rice).
This will force CUSA to add some teams. La Tech is a given and maybe New Mexico State as a travel partner for UTEP if the MWC does not take them. That leaves the WAC with 4 teams and Hawaii has already talked about going independent in foot ball (they would actually be successful too. They have the advantage of a build it Bowl Game if they win 6 games plus any team that schedules a Home & Home with them gets an extra home game the year they have to travel. That leaves San Jose State, Idaho & Utah State are not exactly a great core of schools to build a conference around.
Two extra things:
1) Utah State – Ha Ha Ha. That’s what you get for working behind closed door trying to steal BYU from the MWC!
2) I keep hearing independence is only temporary and BYU will eventually join a BCS school. Ha Ha Ha again.
- PAC12 – They did not want you before and they will not want you ever!
- BIG12 – Their biggest challenge is keeping Texas happy. To do that they can not split their money with any other new teams. Also they were forced into letting Texas have their own network. Does anyone really think they would let the knew kid on the block have a their own TV network?
- MWC -Ha Ha Ha HA!!! Even without BYU & UTAH they are the only non-BCS AQ conference to meet the requirements (none of the rest even come close) to request the exemption. Adding the top 2 teams from CUSA-West takes all the top non-AQ school out west and put them in one conference. The BCS will thank the MWC for doing it’s dirty work by giving it the 7th AQ.
by MtnManRamFan on Sep 1, 2010 12:53 PM PDT up reply actions
My take is that either BYU starts scheduling a bunch of big names (as some of their fans claim they will) and get stomped and have .500 seasons, or they schedule a bunch of patsies and play on wednesdays/thursdays and no one bats an eyelash because they have 3 D-IAA schools on their schedule…
Either way, the real loser in this is BYU basketball and Dave Rose. I’m not sure he is coaching there in a few years.
by Hockey Beard in SLC on Aug 31, 2010 8:12 PM PDT reply actions
Ever heard of Gonzaga?
Last year the MWC ranked like 7th in bball conferences across the country while the WCC ranked like 11th. BYU jumping drops the MWC and bumps up the WCC.
Atleast the bottom dwellers in the WCC have tasted success in bball compared to the crappers at the bottom of the MWC… that includes you TCU.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 8:22 PM PDT up reply actions
Crappers...
yeah, teams like UW, who have won conference titles, been to the big dance, women have won an NIT title, the men won a national championship…
Currently a bottom dweller, but historically a well respected program. I would say UW has tasted some success. So in this case, your comments are not all that appreciated (or backed up by records).
Rec'd and Ditto
I hope TCU stays. That’s good people right.
by Boise State of Mind on Aug 31, 2010 8:13 PM PDT reply actions 1 recs
MUST KEEP TCU HAPPY!
That’s one of the biggest reasons to add Houston and another CUSA team near TCU. I prefer Tulsa since they are the biggest help the the BCS requirements over the past 2 years but I’d be willing to let TCU pick between Tulsa, UTEP, SMU, & Rice.
Houston would help more than TCU...
But it doesn’t really matter because we can’t add these teams so that they are part of the BCS process…
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
SOUR GRAPES
The fact is, once UTAH left, AQ status was a pipe-dream. The MWC needed ALL FOUR of their teams to qualify. Once one jumped shipped, another following suit isn’t a surprise. Get over it and realize that the MWC is the top-notch mid-major conference in the country and be proud of that. BYU was tired of carrying the conference in both $$$ and notoriety.
AQ status was not a pipe dream
In fact it was more reality than anything… We are ahead of the ACC in two categories with BYU. The ACC would not qualify for a BCS Bid if they did not have their orange bowl AQ Bid. That means since the ACC is keeping their bid even though they don’t qualify and the MWC qualifies better than the ACC, the MWC would have been granted an exception. BYU killed that…
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
We are still ahead of the ACC and Big East in both categories without BYU.
The AQ status is not dead yet.
BCS Evolution -- Punctuating the Equilibrium - twitter
by utesfan100 on Aug 31, 2010 8:31 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
just hope
The ACC or Big East fall on their faces
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 31, 2010 10:50 PM PDT up reply actions
YES
Instead of repeating Rebelfan1 I will just agree. While Utah would have put the league closer, them leaving did not kill the chances of the MWC becoming a BCS league.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 31, 2010 10:46 PM PDT up reply actions
BCS AQ Still on Schedule - BYU leaving had no impact - Here's how it works from the BCS website.
A conference will be eligible to apply to the Presidential Oversight Committee for an exemption if it finishes among the top seven in either No. 1 or No. 2 and among the top five in the other and if its ranking in No. 3 is equal to or greater than 33.3 percent of the conference with the highest ranking.
- - Average Ranking of Highest-Ranked Team
- - Average Conference Ranking
- - Top 25 Performance Ranking
- Need to be in the top 5 in Average ranking of Highest-Ranked Team. The MWC without Utah or BYU is currently in 4th with Big East and Big 10 closest and ACC a ways back.
- Just need to be in top 7 – no a problem no other non-BCS conference even comes close & no way of moving higher then 7th even if the MWC still had Utah & BYU
- conference with highest ranking is SEC @ 11.5 that means the MWC would need to be higher than 3.83 and is currently at 7.0 not including a 12.5% adjustment for having less then 12 teams. I’m assuming the MWC will be expanding to 12 very soon.
By adding the top 2 teams from CUSA-West the MWC takes all the top non-AQ/non-independent school out west and put them in one conference. The BCS will thank the MWC for doing it’s dirty work by giving it the 7th AQ. Sorry to the WAC & CUSA but you want to be one of the big boys you have to act like one of the Big Boys!
Fail
Fail.
This is one of the silliest pieces I have ever read on here, and is laughable on so many levels. The BYU haters were biting their tongue, but now they are going to last us have it. Oh no, what will we ever do. The desperation of other MWC teams and fans is ramping up. Without BYU and the U, this conference is going no where, regardless of what other mid major dregs get pulled in.
And so will you..
Except you’ll be playing laughably bad schedules and left over bowl games. And you won’t ever forget the beating you’ll receive the last time you play TCU. At least you’ll enjoy watching a victory over UC-Davis or Montana in HD.
And
honestly whats the difference between half the MWC we play every year and the worst conceivable schedule we could assemble. There is already talk that Utah, ND and Navy will be annual games. That right there has more panache than the top 3 MWC in conference games that we could play. Add in a 3 game series with Texas and games scheduled against Oregon State and you’ve got a solid schedule. I also think it’s funny now that other MWC fans wish us good luck scheduling their garbage teams. Let me tell you something. If BYU calls, they answer the phone and say ‘how high do you want me to jump’. The A.Ds actually have to worry about making money and covering their expenses; something BYU provides in spades. So, aside from all the grandstanding publically and chest thumping by coaches and fans, I wouldn’t surprised if the MWC and WAC A.Ds have already called BYU for future games.
by Big and Sweet on Aug 31, 2010 8:30 PM PDT up reply actions
This conference is going somewhere, just not right now
All we need is to have three top 25 teams per year again by the next evaluation period in 2014-2017. Air Force could easily step into BYU’s place and Boise State stepping into Utah’s. Unfortunately Air Force does not have the stats for this evaluation period, but they will for the next one.
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
Call me biased...
but I think Christensen has UW going in a very good direction. His first year was a success, and if this year achieves the same record… it will be a success as well. We are getting better recruits, we have much better conditioning, and the overall feel is a team that is on the brink of being a tough program that cannot be considered a patsy.
UW was one of the few non-AQ schools that actually had an athletic department that made money (granted, about 1/2 that of what BYU brought it), but considering the 20K tickets we sell a game vs. the 65K that BYU sells… I would say we are doing well. If Dave keeps up the success, that will mean more butts in seats, and more money for the program. Hopefully we can keep him paid and happy. From all indications, he is out to prove something, and saw UW as an excellent school with great potential. I would say within 2 years UW could be a top 25 team. Too bad Dave didn’t come in a few years earlier…
Finally!
Someone that agrees with me about Wyoming. I totally agree with that entire comment. I only got to see Wyoming’s bowl game against Fresno State last season, but that really impressed. Carta-Samuels showed the experience of a senior QB in his fourth year in an offense while he really was a Freshman in his first year in an offense. The defense impressed me as well with that goal line stand in 2OT.
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
Air Force
Is going to be that third team.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 31, 2010 10:54 PM PDT up reply actions
What a headkick to the other BYU athletes
The WCC doesn’t even carry several sports that BYU currently fields.
Can you go independent in track and field? Does BYU get an invite to the MWC League Championship meet? (Answer: No)
I can’t imagine a serious university would even consider ending several scholarship sports and hundreds of athletes like this. Ugly!
FYI, BYU's track and field ranks among the top in the country every year
the MWC doesn’t lift them to that level either. Same goes with Volleyball.
So softball has to play in a regional conference (no league affiliation but the teams that matter have a place to play. Oh, and one other thing, none of those “other programs” at any university have a profit.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 8:25 PM PDT up reply actions
The WCC has volleyball
So that’s not relevant. And I get your point about profit. But you’re still leaving several scholarship sports out in the cold. I’m just surprised at that, that’s all.
I see what you mean
Until all the details come out about how the other sports wil trickle down I can’t share an opinion too much on that. My inital thought would be that I don’t think BYU will cut any scholarships.
With the volleyball thing, I meant they have a national presence by themselves regardless of the conference.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 9:27 PM PDT up reply actions
its just a pain
and i doubt the other coaches like it. Dave Rose got thrown under the bus. A great, great program relegated to a league that has only recently been a two bid league, and that is usually from Gonzaga tripping up in the conference tourney.
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Sour Grapes?
It’s BYU that has sour grapes. They were upset that Utah left to greener pastures. The Utah / Bosie State swap did nothing to hurt the MWC. I think the MWC is still strong. We can live without BYU and I’m sure BYU can live without the MWC. Time will tell for both. It’s interesting that the MWC was on the doorstep of being BCS AQ. BYU not only hurt the conference, but hurt themselves as well. I think BYU’s road to a BCS game just got harder. As for the television issue, nobody watches byu.tv unless you are a member of the church. That’s less exposure than the mtn. They will apparently get some games on ESPN. But, if they play the likes of Texas .. they better win at least 50% of the games they play against BCS schools or ESPN won’t care anymore. They have a tough row to hoe. Good Luck (and good bye)
Wow.
I’m sorry you had a terrible experience with some BYU fans in Las Vegas (it really does sound like they were jerks—every fan base has them). But I guarantee you those fans were not representative of all of us. But then I’ve decided that to a large degree people see what they want to see when it comes to BYU fans.
But then apparently I’m just socially inept. Who knew. Thanks for enlightening me.
You are the nicest BYU fan I have ever met.
All other BYU fans on this blog and fans that I meet at UNLV games are just arrogant (that means you vaughnzipper). They seem to be way overly optimistic about everything regarding BYU while being overly pessimistic about everything else that doesn’t relate to the Cougars.
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
Well, I'm not going to defend vaughnzipper.
But I will say that for whatever reason, there have never really been all that many BYU fans posting here. So it’s probably not a good representation.
I know, but that crowd that I have seen is not too good.
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
BYU fans
I never see any being too disrespectful at games or rude, but what I do see is a lot of them thinking they are better because they got int a tougher school and think they are all that.
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I didn't realize we had beef rebelfan?
That’s okay though. I like to share MY opinion, agree with it or not, it’s MY personal take on things. Not sure where I displayed such arrogance than to defend MY take on BYU against those who hate just to hate and have clearly displayed it here. If you’re referring to my take on BYU to the Big12 I believe it has been fairly supported by non-BYU fans… including Utes! If you want to talk pessimistic look at those who are not BYU fans writing nothing but naysaying about a prgram they don’t even follow (ie this article). Every BYU article on this site has been nothing but bashed negatively by non-BYU fans, and that’s been the case even before this summer began.
Hate if you want to hate. But just for your personal knowledge, UNLV aint full of the nicest people either. Just look at the past decade of BYU v UNLV games @ UNLV.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 9:24 PM PDT up reply actions
We hate BYU because of the ridiculous way they hold themselves up.
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
I can't say I agree
going to UNLV is nothing but Mormon bashing. If you haven’t been to a BYU v UNLV @ UNLV I’d suggest you go, and go with an open ear.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 9:30 PM PDT up reply actions
I went to a basketball game
That wasn’t too bad, but I hear the football games are pretty bad.
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
How bad could they be, there are double the BYU fans in the stands.
Unless it’s BYU fans starting fights, I can’t imagine the 10k rebel football fans causing trouble for the 30k BYU football fans in Sam Boyd. Utah/UNLV is about even (probably 15k utah/10k UNLV), but I’ve been to BYU/UNLV, and it’s not close. Vegas (especially henderson) has a lot of BYU fans.
Everyone hates a pink-shirt-wearing communist.
by displacedute on Sep 1, 2010 11:14 AM PDT up reply actions
At basketball the numbers are definitely on UNLV's side...
But you do see the occasional person wearing a BYU Sweater…
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
I know, but you said that you heard the football games were pretty bad.
I didn’t get that impression, and I find it hard to imagine since the BYU fans outnumber the “bad” UNLV fans by a wide margin.
Everyone hates a pink-shirt-wearing communist.
every school has them
I think where it stems from is that BYU is a religious school with the honor code, and then some of their fans do stuff that are not representative of that outside of campus. That has something to do with it. They say they are held to a higher standard but when are called on it they say whatever.
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Here are some edits to correct your 2nd paragraph
Edits are in bold
I’m not sure what you think will be gained by this move. Sure you will get a little more than twice the amount of moneythan all the remaining teams in the MWC will get combined and you will play some high-profile, nationally televised games on the “Evil Four-Letter” (sorry, I’ve forgotten the actual name of the network almost as badly as the network has forgotten my conference) and you can show off your sweet HD studio that nobody except Texas and others who matter cares about, but besides that what will this accomplish, other than ushering your way to the Big XII in a couple years? All of your sports are now vanquished to the WCC, and all they do is go 10-2 vs Pac10 basketball, actually check that, the WCC doesn’t even have all of your sports just like the MWC didn’t so I’m sure those student-athletes and coaches are thrilled right now. Also just because ESPN seems like the green grass right now remember that you agreed to the creation of The Mtn so we could escape that contract and all of the weeknight games that came with it. So, now that you’ll be playing the likes of Clemson, Texas and ND on ESPN instead of Wyoming, CSU and UNM, we hope you’ll enjoy your Saturday ESPN games. Wait, what was the point of this article?
All it takes is BYU to have a couple of down seasons
And Clemson, Texas and ND will no longer schedule them, leaving Wyoming, CSU and UNM instead.
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
BYU could have a great schedule if they want to do 2 for 1’s. You know who does 2 for 1’s? Schools of a lesser standing….
And if you think BYU is getting in the Big 12 you are dreaming (unless some TV network some how comes up with a ton of money)
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You mean like BYU's tv network combined with ESPN?
I’d say that’s a pretty good combo. BYU should be making in one year what any other MWC team would make in 5, and then some.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 9:32 PM PDT up reply actions
As BYU Gets Beaten More and More...
…the good teams will stop scheduling them because the effect of having BYU on their schedules will start to resemble the effect of having Florida International on their schedules. Then ESPN will quietly drop out of the picture, leaving BYU to BYU-TV, a magnificent, state-of-the-art TV studio that reaches dozens and dozens of Mormons across the country.
Fear the Frog!
Good one Sammy
I love that when BYU beat TCU @ TCU in ‘06 we had more fans in Ammon Carter than your frogs. Dozens and dozens showed up to watch you play… literally. You do realize BYUtv is on all the major cable and satelite networks right? That’s more than the pathetic Mtn channel, that we’ve all been relegated to the past several years, can say.
Yeah nobody would want a school that has been consistently in the top 25 for the past 5 years. Way to make a point, that would look very bad.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 9:52 PM PDT up reply actions
I'm Glad You Noticed
I remember the game in ‘06. That was frustrating. (And it’s Amon, not Ammon.) But we were on the rise, while BYU was headed the other direction. I wasn’t at that game because I lived too far away, but I remember listening to it on the way home from work. And the dozens and dozens of fans we used to get as recently as last year allowed me to, now that I’m closer to Ft. Worth, buy good tickets to every home game the week of the game (except for Utah, which I bought a few weeks ahead).
But, notice what’s happening now…we’ve sold a record number of season tickets (including mine). Still, though, I can’t guarantee you we’ll sell it out; I HOPE so, but no promises. Let’s see who has more fans when you come to Ft.. Worth this year. Let me know if you’ll be here.
Fear the Frog!
by SammyOBrien on Aug 31, 2010 10:13 PM PDT up reply actions
Not much of an arguement
The fact that you are making a challenge as to who will have more fans at YOUR stadium shows how much the MWC needs BYU and the panic that accompanies their departure. You are losing the only team that draws 60k (and that’s with OUR fans, not opposing team’s fans bolstering our attendance.) Let’s see that leaves you with 2 teams that average in the mid 30s (TCU and AFA) That is very WAC-like statistic. Now, what was the downside to leaving this garbage behind?
by Big and Sweet on Sep 1, 2010 7:13 AM PDT up reply actions
bringing up TCU wins for BYU?
Remember 08 and 09 TCU owned BYU, so I wouldnt be bringing up those games. Just like I dont like revisiting Utah in 09 against TCU.
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There are a million possibilities as to how this plays out.
But I think a lot of people are getting ahead of themselves in assuming they know what will happen. That goes for the overly negative scenarios as well as the overly positive ones.
That's not a good enough combo though
Texas won’t let anyone in without major, major dollars…and they’re not fond of a title game as it is, so not likely.
"Lord, beer me strength."
"So, now that you’ll be playing the likes of Clemson, Texas and ND on ESPN"
I hope BYU fans aren’t thinking that ESPN will all of a sudden start putting every BYU game on their networks. Texas vs. BYU? Sure. There’s one. BYU vs. ND will be on NBC and ND gets most of that $$. BYU vs. Clemson? That sounds like an ESPN2 game at best.
But what about the rest of those BYU games in September: BYU vs. Hawaii? BYU vs. Idaho? If you think ESPN, ESPN2, or ESPNU is taking those games over, say, 2nd Tier ACC vs. Chump U or 2nd Tier Big 10 vs. South Chump State, then you don’t really understand how programming works. And that’s September. When Big 10, Big 12, ACC, and Big East league play starts, ESPN has plenty of games to choose from. Since there is not much chance of top tier BCS schools (Alabama, Michigan, USC, etc.) scheduling home and homes with BYU, let’s compare 2nd tier BCS conference matchups to whatever BYU will have scheduled in October and November. What sounds better to ESPN: BYU vs. Baylor, or Texas Tech vs. Oklahoma State? How about BYU vs. Purdue, or Iowa vs. Michigan State?
Check out the posts in the other thread on the home page.
BYU has a deal with ESPN for every home game, and possibly road or neutral games depending on scheduling.
Minor correction
From your own link:
“ESPN will receive first selection rights to all BYU home games”
That doesn’t mean BYU “had a deal with ESPN for every home game.” Rather, it means ESPN can pick whatever home games it wants off of BYU’s schedule. If there are only three on there that it likes, that’s all it’s gonna take.
by VA Libertarian on Sep 1, 2010 12:50 PM PDT up reply actions
Read the press release.
ESPN can broadcast between 3 and 6 BYU home games. If they want 3, they’ll take 3 and BYUTV will get the other three.
Everyone hates a pink-shirt-wearing communist.
We're ALL Missing the Point
I was letting zipper-head’s arrogance get me all worked up. Holly tried, successfully for the most part (but not completely), to redeem the image of BYU fandom. She’s right; every team has it’s a-hole fans. (Some of them frequent Amon Carter in the fall.) BYU just has an inordinately high percentage of them (zipper). In part because they don’t even realize that they’re being a-holes.
But the point, as I’ve been trying to say since this whole “BYU’s gonna go independant” mess started happening, is that the folks who make the decisions about BYU and its athletic programs see those programs only as a publicity tool. I suggested after Fresno State and Nevada committed to the MWC, that the LDS Church (the decision makers) would sacrifice the basketball and “lesser” sports programs at BYU by relegating them to the WCC in order to get more TV coverage for their football program, about which those decision makers have an inappropriately high opinion. And, sure enough (lucky guess on my part), off they go to the WCC and some (I have no idea of the number) student athletes at BYU no longer have a place to play. But, in the eyes of the church, it’s all for a higher purpose – and I guess it is. I’m just glad I wasn’t on one of those teams that just got the carpet yanked out from under their virtual feet.
Again…the folks who made this decision don’t care that BYU has a much higher hill to climb now to the BCS Championship game. They don’t care that there is now no other championship game for which their team can compete. That’s not their goal. They’re not sports fans first. (Maybe third or fourth.)
And Squid’s remark about going to the Big XII/X is a fantasy that he shares with several BYU fans. UT, who runs the conference, along with its lap dogs from Norman and Bryan/College Station, will not agree to splitting up the financial pie any further. They have gone on record, loudly and often, that they do NOT want a conference championship game.
Regardless, I wish you well, BYU, as you try to find opponents for your football team (wait…no I don’t.) Your leadership doesn’t care, or if they do they are deluding themselves, that you’re not good enough to play the really good teams in college football on a week-to-week basis. Most of the teams that you will be able to schedule without embarrassing yourselves will only water-down your team, your ranking and your reputation.
Fear the Frog!
by SammyOBrien on Aug 31, 2010 9:33 PM PDT reply actions 4 recs
e.g. rebelfan
Because I’m sure you’ve done extensive research on the financial success BYU will gain from this, you sat in all the board meetings for BYU or the WCC, and you signed off on this whole deal your opinion on the matter has brought much for us to consider. Way to bring absolutely nothing to the table Sammy.
You TCU fans seem to be the most bitter! Boy oh boy, you guys have sure taken this to heart! You all are just a bunch of teenage girls. Wow, pull up skirts and move on.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 9:41 PM PDT up reply actions
Yep
This is why everyone hates BYU (^above^).
by VA Libertarian on Aug 31, 2010 10:10 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
What about me?
I didn’t make that comment you replied to…
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
It wasn't calling you out
I did that to show you more proof of what I mentioned above. Straight naysayers and pessimists.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 10:35 PM PDT up reply actions
You're Right...We Need to Move On
Our predictions of BYU’s fate are based, primarily, in our disappointment over what is (or, more correctly, is NOT) going to happen for your former conference. We should just sit back and watch the show.
But, I agree with Libby, responses like yours are, generally speaking, the kinds of things that generate such a warm opinion of BYU fans.
Fear the Frog!
by SammyOBrien on Aug 31, 2010 10:36 PM PDT up reply actions
I have yet to meet a TCU fan with a warm opinion of BYU
So excuse my tone if it eerily imitates those of the Frog faithful. Reread your post Sammy, I merely shared the same attitude back to you.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 10:42 PM PDT up reply actions
What would you call a “warm opinion” of BYU? Two of my very good friends went to BYU, and they’re both great to watch a game with. I’ve also met my share of idiot BYU fans, but that’s life for any football fan I know. As a school, I have nothing but respect for BYU.
As a member of the MWC though, I not only think that independence will be bad for BYU, but also hurt my team much more than a loss to the cougars ever could. I hope that TCU stomps the hell out of BYU this year and then does not play BYU again outside of a bowl setting- purely business. Why should we help fill out a schedule for a team that has done us such a disservice?
So what is a warm opinion of BYU now? I used to have one, now I probably won’t root for BYU to beat anyone (apart from 0U or Baylor), but I won’t root against them either, unless they play someone from the MWC.
I Was Being Sarcastic
I should have put “warm opinion” in quotes. My bad.
But, in fact, I used to think quite highly of the BYU football team. (And I still think they are quite good and, when I’m not grousing over how their decision to go independant in football has screwed us, a very respectable bunch.) The BYU game is a game for which TCU needs to be especially well prepared — a game that I consider to be a challenge every year we play them, which will only happen twice more for the foreseeable future.
Now, I also have a good deal of resentment toward BYU because their decision to go independant in football, while working toward one of their church’s primary goals, works most decidedly against one of the MWC’s (and, thus, TCU’s) primary goals. Please just allow me my tantrum.
Thank you.
Fear the Frog!
What advantage did this bring to non-football sports?
This decision clearly demonstrates that the University doesn’t care about it’s other sports. Looks like you’ll be losing a lot of non-football sport coaches in the near future because the school didn’t listen to their concerns in this decision making process.
No, that's just the point
His panty rant paraded nothing but speculation but yet he seems to think all his points were what actually happened. Jeremy, did you not recognize the sarcasm at him? Come on man.
sometimes its hard to tell
Plus I was up reading and commenting late last night, just missed it I guessed.
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Is That Question Directed at Me, Jeremy?
No, I haven’t sat in those meetings. But, because I DO know what motivates churches — spreading their theology — I know that if the LDS church is making decisions, the eftect of those decisions on the BYU athletic programs is NOT their number one concern.
That’s all I’m saying.
Fear the Frog!
Agreed
The Big XII will never take BYU in. The people who think this have really never followed the politics of the Big XII, and that’s quite obvious.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 31, 2010 10:11 PM PDT up reply actions
Here's my question though.
I completely agree that the BIg 12 isn’t going to expand anytime in the near future. But I don’t think it’s possible to say with any degree of certainty that they’re NEVER going to expand. So, setting aside any sort of time table here, if at some point in the future (be it 2 years or 5 years or 10 years) they changed their mind for whatever reason, why are people sure that BYU wouldn’t even be a possibility? I’m genuinely asking, as it seems as though I’m missing something, here, because I’ve never heard anything about BYU specifically (just about not adding any teams at all, BYU or not).
Whoever says that is wrong
If the Mack 10 were going to expand BYU would most certainly be at the top of the list. They bring a new market and large fan base. Which are the main reasons TCU will NEVER EVER see an invite to the Mack 10
"Football is a violent game played by violent people, so put a smile on your face, murder in your heart and lets go kick these f***kers in the mouth" -Dick Bumpas, TCU Defensive Coordinator
by Ben Findley on Aug 31, 2010 10:19 PM PDT up reply actions
Right.
You’ve been paying attention to what’s been said outside of this blog.
Fear the Frog!
by SammyOBrien on Aug 31, 2010 10:20 PM PDT up reply actions
See, that's what I thought.
But others seem so dead certain, that I thought I must be missing something.
Glad to know I’m not crazy.
You're not crazy, Holly...
…you’re just not as maniacal as some of us here!
Fear the Frog!
by SammyOBrien on Aug 31, 2010 10:24 PM PDT up reply actions
youre not crazy
It may be a few years but I think the Big XII will get to 12
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I couldn't disagree more
No way.
Many reasons:
1.) Travel (this is particularly of importance for sports other than football)
2.) The Big XII does not want a title game again. Ever. 4 times in 14 years it directly cost a Big XII team a shot at the national championship, and it should have cost them a shot two other times.
3.) If people think there’s a healthy distaste for Mormons in places like Las Vegas, I don’t think they’ve ever spent much time in Texas. I lived there for 19 years. This isn’t a dealbreaker by any means, but it’ll certainly be a prejudicial factor in ever letting the Cougars in.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 31, 2010 10:35 PM PDT up reply actions
On travel, Texas was thisclose to going to the Pac 10. That’s way worse travel than BYU.
And I realize you live in Texas and I don’t (though I have a sister who does—there are quite a lot of Mormons in her area), I feel fairly confident you’re overstating the Mormon factor.
meh
I actually don’t believe Texas would have ever made that jump alone. You’re forgetting that they were however close to jumping with A&M, OU, and OSU, and I don’t even think they were that close (I think a lot of it was posturing for revenue, exposure, and ego).
Also, though it’s likely that the area your sister lives in isn’t/wasn’t averse to the LDS church, there’s a whole lot of Texas that doesn’t know/understand much about them. I’d sort of relate it to people’s insane views of Islam – they don’t know a lot of Muslims so they believe all sorts of wild tales about them.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 31, 2010 10:47 PM PDT up reply actions
I don't disagree that a lot of people don't know much about Mormons.
But that doesn’t automatically equate hate.
If anything, an area particularly averse to Mormons is the Bay Area (where I live). And BYU just joined the WCC, a conference with teams in the Bay Area. I really don’t think the Mormon thing is all that much of an issue for Texas.
I would think
The Bay Area, known as a bastion of tolerance in our country, has better views of the LDS church than Texas does – which, unfortunately, is not known for its religious tolerance.
And I’d agree that generally a lack of knowledge doesn’t equal hate, but in a lot of cases in Texas and the South, there’s misinformation put out that does pump hatred. Many evangelicals, pentecostals, etc. have an agenda in framing Mormons as cultists… I don’t know why, but I’ve heard it a lot.
I hate that this has been my observational experience, but it’s true. Personally, I have a lot of respect for the way Mormons carry themselves and the values they instill in their members and children, even though I disagree with their religious doctrine.
by VA Libertarian on Sep 1, 2010 1:00 AM PDT up reply actions
You live on the East Coast
So you probably aren’t too aware of what’s happening on the West Coast. I’m sure you’ve at least heard of the whole prop 8 situation regarding gay marriage. Well the LDS church was a big contributer fighting to keep marriage traditional while the rest of the city of San Fran and California bashed and bashed and bashed (and continue to bash and bash and bash) the LDS church. I assure you, despite our large footprint in CA the LDS church is much more discriminated there than anywhere else, Texas doesn’t hold a candle. Just speaking from experience.
Your ignorance knows no bounds
I live in Colorado. That’s clearly stated in my profile.
Also, I’m quite aware of the Prop. 8 situation. I’ve worked in politics most of my life, including work inside a national political party headquarters after I got out of college.
Nevertheless, despising a church’s stance on one political issue (particularly a current hot-button issue) pales in comparison to the deep-seated mistrust of a Mormonism that I’ve seen in Texas and the Southeast.
The anger over the LDS church’s stance on Prop. 8 will fade a lot quicker than the whole ‘mormonism is a cult’ thing in Texas and elswhere.
Side note: Blacks also disproportionately fought against gay marriage. Are you suggesting that blacks are also hated the most in CA?
by VA Libertarian on Sep 1, 2010 1:30 AM PDT up reply actions
Ok
Sorry for not reading your profile, geez! It’s not like I’m looking to date you or something, ease off the gas peddle. My intention wasn’t to call you ignorant, I just assumed you still live in S. Carolina.
I forgot, you’re the Mormon so you know what we experience being such. I have first hand experience being a Mormon in both states while you have none. You know you’re true colors are showing if you think that how YOU feel is how every Texan feels.
“Side note: Blacks also disproportionately fought against gay marriage. Are you suggesting that blacks are also hated the most in CA?” Anybody else think this crosses a line? Judging your profile pic you’re probably one of the white guys in it. So again your speculation, or idea, of throwing an entire race, which you are not a part of, into a group is pretty pathetic. You have some deeper problems you need to address dude.
Must be overly upset that BYU’s played for a rugby NC the last 5 years or something.
You and your assumptions
This is why I discredit most of what you say: You assumed I still live in the place I went to school. It wouldn’t take but a second to fact-check this instead of making a huge leap in logic about where I live and what I know.
Also, whoopity do that you’re a Mormon and I’m not. Do you think I can’t witness what discrimination looks like without being one? Does this make me acutely unaware of how people other than me are treated? Am I no longer capable of observing how blacks, Hispanics, women, etc. are treated in various locales? Get real, buddy. This line of logic is incredibly faulty. I’ve also stated quite clearly that I don’t have a problem with Mormons (I have Mormons in my family, if you must know), and am a Taoist. You act as though one can’t grasp that one can view others’ hate without being hateful themselves, which is ridiculous.
As for your race-baiting…. please. I didn’t “speculate…of throwing an entire race.” I merely noted that blacks disproportionately voted against gay marriage. I didn’t say all blacks, and I didn’t say to what degree. But it happened. There are exit poll numbers to prove it. The only reason I bring it up is because I was trying to show you the absurdity of your line of logic concerning CA attitudes towards Mormons based on Prop. 8.
And, no, I’m not upset about BYU playing for the rugby national championship. They actually have one of the top programs in the country, and I have a lot of respect for that. The State of Utah (alongside Colorado and California), in general, takes rugby a lot more seriously than most places, and I think that’s pretty cool.
by VA Libertarian on Sep 1, 2010 10:32 AM PDT up reply actions
Your ignorance knows no bounds
I live in Colorado, not the East Coast. That’s clearly stated in my profile.
Also, I’m quite aware of the Prop. 8 situation. I’ve worked in politics most of my life, including work inside a national political party headquarters after I got out of college.
Nevertheless, despising a church’s stance on one political issue (particularly a current hot-button issue) pales in comparison to the deep-seated mistrust of a Mormonism that I’ve seen in Texas and the Southeast.
The anger over the LDS church’s stance on Prop. 8 will fade a lot quicker than the whole ‘mormonism is a cult’ thing in Texas and elswhere.
Side note: Blacks also disproportionately fought against gay marriage. Are you suggesting that blacks are also hated the most in CA?
by VA Libertarian on Sep 1, 2010 1:32 AM PDT up reply actions
thats right
It was the other schools that helped them stay
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Ummm...
I’m from Texas and I couldn’t disagree with you more. Just because you hate Mormons, or hung with a crowd that did, doesn’t mean Texas does. In fact outside of Utah and CA they have the largest LDS population in the nation.
Big 12 doesn’t want one but the BCS will eventually tell them tough nuts if they don’t. Texas runs the show in the Big 12, not across the country.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 10:39 PM PDT up reply actions
You going to the TCU/BYU game, VZ?
Fear the Frog!
by SammyOBrien on Aug 31, 2010 10:40 PM PDT up reply actions
Not this year
But I have in years past. I am an avid ’Boys fan and partook of the BYU festivities last year without a problem.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 10:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Um...
I don’t hate Mormons at all – I’m actually a Taoist. But I’ve witness plenty of Mormon hatred.
I distinctly recall a Humanities class in high school where we were discussing Dante’s Inferno, and my teacher had to shut down all discussion because kids were arguing that Joseph Smith belonged in Hell as a false prophet. I also witnessed a classmate get continually rattled for being Mormon, and must of heard the “Mormonism is a cult” speech a thousand times from my various Christian friends.
As for whatever raw numbers of Mormons there are in Texas, remember that Texas is nearly 25 million people, and I’m betting LDS members are quite small %-wise.
P.S. You’re taking this way too personally, because I did say “This isn’t a dealbreaker by any means.” I was merely pointing it out.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 31, 2010 10:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Not taking it personal
I just think it’s a completely moot point that holds ZERO bearing. It was your opinion, brought about by your thoughts…
That same story could be said about Mormons in any state, even Utah.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 10:46 PM PDT up reply actions
I disagree
I think it has some bearing – I just don’t think it has a lot of bearing. It’s one of those ‘tipping point’ things though. If people are already iffy on adding BYU, it’s one of the things that could/would blow the deal up.
It’s irrelevant in the long run, however, as I don’t believe BYU would ever get close enough in terms of consideration for it to ever matter.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 31, 2010 10:49 PM PDT up reply actions
That's your opinion
I see it differently though. That’s what makes the world go round.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 10:52 PM PDT up reply actions
Of course you see it differently
You’re a BYU fan. Of course you’re going to overstate your team’s value/importance.
I’m neutral to the matter (I’m a South Carolina fan who just loves college football), and grew up in Big XII territory. No way, man.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 31, 2010 10:53 PM PDT up reply actions
Interesting comment
Overstating? I’m pretty sure I have more people agreeing that BYU has a good chance of going Big12 if push comes to shove. You have… no one.
It’s funny you try and say you’re neutral yet you admit you’re from Big12 country? Netural? I think not.
FYI, I was born in Big12, raised in Pac10, yet all the while a BYU fan. Not all Y fans and their opinions are from the Utah bubble. Yes way, man.
by vaughnzipper on Sep 1, 2010 12:43 AM PDT up reply actions
not a chance
Um… yes, neutral. I’m not a Big XII fan, I just lived there. And I never said or insinuated that most BYU fans were from Utah – I try not to make the sort of mistake-prone assumptions that you put forth.
And I sincerely doubt you have more people agreeing with you, nor have I seen that. Also, would that really matter (most people think there should be a playoff. Will it happen? No.)?
So… no. No way, man.
by VA Libertarian on Sep 1, 2010 1:38 AM PDT up reply actions
Evidence?
How and when would the BCS ever tell the Big XII ‘tough nuts" for not having a title game? I’m assuming they’d be cracking down on the 8-team Big East first, and that’s even less likely than the Big XII reaching 12 teams again.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 31, 2010 10:44 PM PDT up reply actions
No hard evidence
Just read a lot of blogs and articles that have led me to believe that the BCS will eventually require it. Shoot I even remember ESPN discussing that issue and having several polls discussing the matter. It’s been a highly speculated situation for a few months now.
by vaughnzipper on Aug 31, 2010 10:48 PM PDT up reply actions
I'd like to see these blogs
Because I’ve never seen any credible evidence on the matter.
And, again, they’d have to crack down on the Big East first and somehow defend their Notre Dame policy.
The BCS also isn’t likely to try and play hard ball with Texas either, seeing as it’s easily the most profitable program in the country.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 31, 2010 10:50 PM PDT up reply actions
Well, I'm glad I was somewhat successful, I guess.
But I’ve given up on trying to dissuade people. I’m convinced there’s a great deal of tunnel vision or seeing what they want to see in the perceptions of BYU fans, others are convinced I’m a rare exception. No one is ever going to change the other’s minds. So I’m done worrying about it. There’s no point in getting worked up over something I can’t control, especially if it makes being a fan less fun for me.
by holly96 on Aug 31, 2010 10:17 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Agreed
You’re definitely one of the nicest BYU fans I’ve ever met. If only people like ‘vaughnzipper’ could manage to be even remotely like you, the world would be a much better place.
by VA Libertarian on Sep 1, 2010 10:34 AM PDT up reply actions
You're Right...We Are Pretty Bitter
Because we all were on the brink of something very special that we had all worked hard to achieve. All of us including BYU. (And Utah.)
The only thing that most of us post on here is our opinion. And I’m no different. I’m not saying that the LDS church is evil because they’re not looking at this as sports fans; just the opposite. The fact that their motivation differs from most folks here on this blog is just a fact of life. They are a church and their goal is spreading their faith. No, I wasn’t in the board meetings, I just have a realistic view of what they’re trying to achieve. They have much more important things on their minds than games.
Fear the Frog!
Wow. I missed all the fun.
Actually, I didn’t. But I did miss all of this.
I do want to clarify one thing: my ‘televangelism’ remark wasn’t meant as a pejorative. It was simply the shortest possible way to summarize a motive.
Also, as far as BYU’s motivation goes: it may seem odd to make a move that appears to put the TV commercials ahead of their sports programs, but we can’t ignore that BYU is ultimately an extension of a church, and that church (like most churches) wants to get its message out. If they feel it’s more important to do that, then at least they’re staying consistent to their point of view.
I can’t blame them for wanting more money either. Every athletic department in the country seems caught up in a craze to get more. I’m at Tennessee right now, and if they could convince Starbucks to put orange Power T’s in the foam on lattes, they’d happily negotiate a branding fee for it. The local airwaves are filled with commercials that try to guilt-trip us if we don’t buy the ‘official’ t-shirt for the opening game (seriously; they pull out the ‘true fan’ schtick and everything). The bigger an athletic department’s support base, the more insane their obsession with money becomes. Everybody’s trying to get more money, and I can’t knock BYU for it.
It’s not like BYU’s decision was entirely bad. I feel it was premature, especially when they could have taken a year to weigh their options and wait to see how the other conferences panned out. But they disagree with my opinion on that, and that’s fine. The WCC isn’t a bad place for their other sports and they’ll find a way to take care of the rest. The media types at the school are undoubtedly thrilled, though.
I got it
and felt the term appropriate and funny. BYU wants to promote their church through football, but they will not have ads about joining the church on BYUTV partly because it has affiliation with PBS and they do not take kindly to that stuff. At most there maybe a promo about an upcoming show but that is it.
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Hadn't heard of the affiliation.
Still, I doubt that would stop the LDS from showing ads; even if PBS doesn’t like it, they’d be hard-pressed to justify excluding them, especially when things are being produced through BYU’s own media center. Kinda like how the Tebow ad ran during the Super Bowl.
I think the ads is sort of secondary.
I think the “televangelism” thing (I didn’t take it as a pejorative, either, don’t worry) is just as much about getting exposure to church members, get people maybe interested in learning more, even if it’s not through ads that talk about actual church principals. I think that’s also part of the reason why BYU has always wanted to be able to play schools in different areas.
I’m disappointed by this for so many reasons. I felt BYU was a team that TCU could finally build up a good in-conference rivalry with- we haven’t had one since we were with Rice and SMU in the WAC. I felt that BYU would be beside TCU and Boise State as we climbed definitively over the Big East and ACC to full BCS status. I felt that even without Utah, when Fresno and Nevada were secured we would be a better conference.
Earlier today I felt betrayed and hurt, like our comrade in arms stabbed us in the back. Now I’m just disappointed with how this turned out. I think BYU’s football team will regret independence, even if the church will benefit from the added exposure. I think that this will serve to drop them further below Utah, rather than keep up with them as BYU is obviously hoping it does. Time will tell, I suppose. The MWC won’t be having you back though, so if independence doesn’t work out, it’ll have to be CUSA who takes you on.
Possible
This is a definite risk. If I had my way, BYU and Utah would have stayed and we add Fresno and Houstion. Hell of a conference. When Utah left, though, it set the dominos in motion. A 50-50 shot at an AQ bid, became an outside shot at best. And honestly, in most situations in life you give some concessions to the money bringer. BYU brought the largest slice of the value of the MTN network (I may be wrong, but, I’ve heard from numerous sournces over the years it is around 60%), but were constantly treated as if they were just another member of the conference. If you were a salesman at work and pulled in most of the sales but got paid like everyone else, you would move too. BYU played ball for a decade, but just weren’t given enough stroke for the value they were bringing to the table.
by Big and Sweet on Sep 1, 2010 7:30 AM PDT up reply actions
I hate how everyone thinks that the AQ was gone once Utah left or even when BYU left.
With Utah we had an 80% or better chance. We probably could have qualified the way the BCS would like with them by placing in the top 6 in all three categories. Once they left, we had a 50% or better chance because of the exemption proccess the BCS had included. The MWC was ranked in the top 3 in two of the three categories and seventh in the other one, making the MWC eligible for an exemption. With the ACC not meeting the qualification standards of being in the top 6 for the two categories that the MWC was ranked in the top 3, they would normally have their BCS AQ stripped, but because of their Orange Bowl Tie-In, they will keep it. It would be impossible for the BCS to say that a BCS Conference that does not qualify keeps their AQ while saying that a Non-BCS Conference that does qualify does not get an AQ… After BYU left, we were still in the top 5 in the two categories that we were previously top 3.
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
Disappointing
As someone who actually does care about BYU football, I think I need to start a new website. FireTomHolmoe.com.
Sounds good to me
I wonder how many non-football sport coaches will move on to other jobs because of the shaft they just got.
Like who?
In basketball terms it was a better move. It will keep them even keel in terms of conference but with exposure via ESPN. Volleyball stays a national power, WCC doesn’t have a v-ball league. Our Cross Country teams have a home in the WCC, they’ll maintain their national presence.
So which BYU coaches would jump? All the power teams that we have are moving (or staying) into a better position.
how is hoops a better move
The WCC is a step down. 4 bids to 2, plus the WCC is usually a one bid league with the exception of the past few years.
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Take away 1 and add 1
It’s even in terms of conference but better when you thow in they have the exposure with ESPN.
Not even close
Back in March, the MWC had the 6th ranked conference RPI, while the WCC had the 13th ranked RPI.
Take away the most consistent team in the MWC the last 5 years
and add that to the WCC. Plus take away Utah, who eventhough had a bad year last year contributed, then add BSU, UNR, and FSU and your ratings drop very quickly!
The leagues are much closer now
But even with BYU in the WCC their league is not going to be 6th in the RPI as the MWC was last year. Nevada is a solid program and coser to BYU then they are to Boise State.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Sep 1, 2010 10:08 AM PDT up reply actions
What about UNLV, SDSU...
They were pretty consistent as well.
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
Yes
But not the most consistent. BYU has shared or outright won the conference title 3 out of the last 5 years.
Records over last 5 years:
BYU : 127-40 = 76.0%, 5 NCAA Bids
UNLV : 120-53 = 69.3%, 4 NCAA Bids
SDSU : 117-52 = 69.2%, 2 NCAA bids, 3 NIT (which resulted in a few extra wins)
AMEN
From a Mormon who cares nothing for BYU ……………… may you fade into obscurity and never be seen again!
Why do people bring up conference titles?
No one respects a MWC Conference Title. Basketball regular season titles don’t even get acknowledged. What’s the point?
BYU has resources that they don’t want to go unused. Why can’t they better their own situation? The new landscape of college athletics is becoming a do whats best for yourself type of world. That’s what BYU is doing, improving their profile.
Dan Wetzel over at Yahoo! who studies the BCS in-depth even said the MWC had no shot of a BCS AQ bid when Utah left.
Now going Independent will open doors to some better bowl tie-ins out West.
This is a smart move by BYU that had to be done. If anyone else in this league had the resources BYU does and the following, they would do the same thing. End of story.
by BYUmitch on Sep 1, 2010 8:27 AM PDT reply actions 1 recs
Bowl tie ins
Hopefully would get better, but conference titles give athletes to shoot for something. I do not disagree that they are really relevant, but if byu is 2-2 or worse what do they really have to play for. There are bowl games but if the season is a mediocre one the bowl game is not going to be good.
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Well duh
Obviously BYU has better resources than the rest of the MWC due to the fact that they are a private institution that is fully funded with money from the LDS. Meanwhile most of the rest of the MWC schools are public universities that are taxpayer funded and have budgets that need to be kept and met because they can’t demand 10% of their alumni income. The LDS hierarchy is foolish(thank god I’m not Mormon or I might be excommunicated for saying that) if they think that putting games on BYU-TV is going to increase their exposure. The thing forgotten, or probably ignored in this case, is that people don’t watch sports so they can be bombarded by religious propaganda. They watch sports to escape reality. To enjoy their favorite teams successes or failures. I think I represent a typical sports fan, I don’t care who sponsors what game. I don’t care what commercials are on during time-outs, unless its humorous Super Bowl ads. I don’t care where the game is being played. I want one thing and one thing only, to be able to watch my team compete and hopefully win. I think it’s been pretty much established at this point that people don’t want to deal with anything controversial during their sporting events. Just look at the outcry against Tim Tebow and his Super Bowl spot advocating the Pro-Life movement. The LDS need to get with reality and understand that religion is on the decline in the US, and that trying to force it down our throats is going to do the opposite of what they are trying to accomplish.
I can see what you mean, I too am one who doesn't care about the sponsor
But just because it’s on BYUtv does not mean that every commercial will be a religious spot. You can do a commercial without having to show a half naked chick or a dude drinking beer. BYU will benefit from the ads that (and I’m not saying these are inked or even been talked about) a business like Papa Johns (a BYU sponsor) or chik-fil-a (I say chik-fil-a because of their religious roots) or Coca Cola (a BYU sponsor), etc, etc.
I think people are making too much of the religious advertising angle.
BYU wants to be on ESPN for the same reason. Do you think you are going to be bombarded with LDS ads on ESPN? No, of course not. But it still increases exposure to the church, even if it’s in a way not directly related to spiritual issues.
Can I get an e-mail address for Dan Wetzel?
He obviously doesn’t know what he is talking about if he thought the MWC had no shot at an AQ once Utah left (see multiple posts throughout threads by me explaining why that is not the case if you need confirmation).
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UNLV is going all the way this year!

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