REPORT: BYU And Mountain West To Kiss And Make Up On Thursday
by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 25, 2010 6:24 PM PDT
in Conference Expansion
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PrintThe Denver Posts Natalie Meisler is reporting that tomorrow BYU will stay with the Mountain West but there are little details surrounding their report:
I'm hearing from a number of sources that the Mountain West/BYU impasse could be resolved as soon as Thursday with all indications that the Cougars will remain in the MWC.
That does not say much about any concessions -- if any for BYU -- but Natalie Meisler makes a good point about a quick resolution between BYU and the Mountain West:
And here's one more practical reason for a quick resolution. The football season opens next week.
There are little details in this so not sure how much she really knows about the situation, but concessions must have been made for BYU to stay in the league. Some options are too allow BYU to simulcast some games on BYU-TV and perhaps show non-televised championship events which is what they had in the WAC agreement.
Or, Craig Thompson could have played hardball and tell BYU to go to the WCC or the beaten down WAC, but I doubt he would have what it takes to place an ultimatum to the team he needs the most.
If this is the case a twelfth member is a must because an eleven conference football league and basketball league is tough to pull off. Utah State was a backup plan, but on the site here Houston and UTEP have had heated suggested on who to bring in. The WAC is pretty much done and do not be surprised if La. Tech leaves to join either the Sun Belt -- where they would be an instant top three team -- or C-USA which would leave them with thirteen teams and a good chance for Houston to join the Mountain West.
Jay Drew from the Salt Lake Tribune contacted Meisler and had this to say:
Reached by telephone Wednesday night, Meisler stressed that "it is not 100 percent" certain that the issue has been resolved, but that "I feel good about it."
She said her sources are schools "in and out of the league" and that there are at least three sources telling her the deal is headed in this direction.
When all is in doubt go with Dick Harmon who will not believe anything until he sees it.
I think BYU's priority is to go indy and if the MWC wants to deal, it would have to do backflips for Y. Believe it when I see it -BYU/MWC
Dick Harmon
Harmonwrites
There is still the option of BYU joining the West Coast Conference since there are reports about BYU contacting them.
The news first came from an excellent reporter from the San Jose Mercury News' Jon Wilner who said BYU has plans to contact the WCC:
I've been told that BYU has reached out to the West Coast Conference about the possibility of placing its 18 teams that don't play football into the WCC.
In the interest of full disclosure, let's be clear: I'm not sure whether the Cougars will talk to WCC officials or meet in person with WCC officials. But according to a source, communication in some form will take place this week.
(I tried getting a comment/confirmation from WCC commish Jamie Zaninovich, who acknowledged last week that he had reached out to BYU. But Zaninovich did not respond to text or voice messages or to an email request for an interview.)
One minor problem with the WCC is that they do not carry all the sports that BYU has and they are not about to cut sports, specifically women's to be in the WCC. The WCC does not have swimming, cross country, softball, or track and trying to find another league for those sports is a ton of work for BYU's AD Tom Holmoe.
Going back to the Mountain West was the only option once Fresno State and Nevada left the WAC.
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I know this is the MWC blog but....
If its true about Utah State joining the MWC, Hawaii going independent, and Louisiana Tech going to the Sun Belt, what will happen to the rest of the WAC?
One can assume New Mexico St could also go to the Sun Belt but what about Idaho and San Jose St? I sounds that all the possible WAC expansion candidates don’t qualify for multiple reasons like lacks of number of NCAA sports. Anyone think they’ll drop down to FCS?
I don't think Utah St. is coming to the MWC
There doesn’t appear to be any landing spots for SJSU and Idaho if the WAC were to dissolve. They would either have drop down to FCS (Big Sky and/or Big West) or just scrap their football programs altogether.
Or...
Become independent.
A lot of programs have to do this while in transition mode to FBS play, so it’s not inconceivable that SJSU and the Vandals could do this for a few years while they wait for a new invite or more FCS teams to move up (UTSA, Texas State, etc.).
by VA Libertarian on Aug 25, 2010 7:43 PM PDT up reply actions
AGREE
It will be tough but may be their only option for a few years. They will at least be able to still schedule those other teams for a built in 4 or 5 game set schedule
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 25, 2010 7:47 PM PDT up reply actions
In these economic times
I’d say darn near impossible to go the indie route. They would lose the WAC TV revenues but still have to maintain the cost of a football program. Ouch.
They could simply schedule a few home games against each other
and a lot of cash games against big-money teams. E.g. 4 home games and 8 cash games.
by David Hooper on Aug 25, 2010 8:29 PM PDT up reply actions
its all possible
Utah State is trying to get into the MWC but if the MWC was trying to kill the WAC and bring BYU back it would have been done by now. Hawaii is talking to go indy and join the Big West, but I dont see that since that is considered the Cal-State Bus League, and La. Tech is so out of place they would be smart to go to the Sun Belt or C-USA if they lose Houston to the MWC.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 25, 2010 7:46 PM PDT up reply actions
Hopefully this will put the kibosh on the Utah State hubbub once and for all, and we can focus on bringing in Houston to boost our BCS stats to the point where our superiority over the ACC and Big East cannot be denied.
As much as I've been pushing for UTEP
I would definitely take Houston over Utah State. I think the Houston crowd would even agree that they’d take UTEP over Utah State. Nobody wants Utah State.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 25, 2010 7:37 PM PDT up reply actions
yup!
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 25, 2010 7:47 PM PDT up reply actions
Except for the fact that none of these teams will join in time to neither "boost" nor sink BCS stats.
Besides, I’m fairly certain that neither Houston nor UTEP are switching leagues. That all seems to have been a pipe-dream rumor with not much backing it up. If one of them is going to switch, I suppose we’ll know before this time next week. The MWC will take Utah State because, I’m willing to bet, it’s one of BYU’s stipulations for staying in the conference. “Big brother” looking after little and etc. Mark my words. Or don’t. This is all speculation, after all.
by FeloniousMonk on Aug 25, 2010 9:24 PM PDT up reply actions
On your last part, I just don't see this at all.
I can only speak as a fan, but I really don’t see BYU caring all that much about Utah St., certainly not enough for them to make a difference to staying in the conference.
to kill off the WAC once and for all
That is the only reason to bring in USU.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 26, 2010 10:14 AM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, but why do we care about the WAC? The only reason to bring in Utah St.
is if they help us.
And really, I was talking about BYU. There’s no way Utah St. being in the MWC would be some sort of incentive to stay.
if the WAC
is dead BYU has no place to go, that is why if MWC thought they had no shot at BYU they would have already invited the MWC. That is why Utah State is valuable
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 26, 2010 2:08 PM PDT up reply actions
I think BYU's chances of going to the WAC were dead as soon as Fresno and Nevada bailed.
I really don’t think Utah State is all that valuable.
This is great news for the MWC
But I’m still nervous about that possible 12th team. Utah State seems to be the only school that has been seriously linked to the MWC.
I haven’t seen any credible reports linking Houston to the MWC, just a lot of speculation because they seem like the most obvious choice.
Most speculate.....
that the MWC/CUSA meeting was not only a way to give the appearance that both conferences were separating themselves from the rest of the mid majors (not that the MWC needed any help in that) by the proposed Bi-Conference Championship Game for a BCS bid, but also a way to tell each other to stay away from each others schools. But some also speculate that their may have been a tentative agreement to give UTEP to the MWC for the inclusion of LA Tech thus killing the WAC (which is what the MWC wanted to be the only non BCS conference in the Western time Zone to gain prestige). This also would reduce travel cost for CUSA West. There is no way CUSA gives up Houston without a fight, so if the annexation of Houston does not get the MWC the auto-bid then they have just burned their plan B bridge with CUSA. Thompson is to shrewd for that. Its either Utah St or UTEP in my book, UofH is a pipe dream (for now)…….
by TowerPower on Aug 25, 2010 9:26 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Makes sense to me
Houston would be the most extreme geographic entrant in the MWC. UTEP is currently the most extreme geographic entrant in the C-USA.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 25, 2010 9:36 PM PDT up reply actions
I Agree, But...
Do we really think that UTEP, with all due respect, will do anything but water-down the MWC in terms of BCS status? Yeah, they’d get us to 12 teams, assuming BYU stays. (As things develop, I’m backing off my earlier statements that BYU is definitely gone — they may be gone, but the developing situation is less certain.) And UTEP is a geographic and historic fit for traveling and inter-conference rivalries.
But, neither of those truly improve our status. We’d just be adding another reason for the original “BCS 6,” whether or not they include us in 2012, to throw rocks at our credibility. And giving the ACC and Big East room to whine about how the MWC, top to bottom, is not any better than they are (reality be damned).
Fear the Frog!
by SammyOBrien on Aug 26, 2010 11:19 AM PDT up reply actions
UTEP would not join until 2012 as would Houston
so any expansion at this point would be irrelevant to our BCS Stats. Except for in the case of BYU who would leave by 2011.
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UNLV is going all the way this year!
by rebelfan1 on Aug 26, 2010 1:29 PM PDT up reply actions 1 recs
Good Point
I still stand by my assertion that adding another mid-to-low-level team isn’t good for the conference’s efforts to gain respect from the clowns in the BCS.
Now, I’m OK with just ignoring their spouting. We just need to realize that adding “lesser” teams is just loading their propganda cannon.
Fear the Frog!
On The Other Hand
The best outcome that we could expect might be for LaTech to go to C-USA, UTEP to come to the MWC and the WAC to go to Division II (or whatever the BCS Cartel is calling it these days) if the WAC doesn’t simply disolve.
Fear the Frog!
very good points
they would be more willing to do that since UTEP is off by itself in CUSA.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 25, 2010 9:37 PM PDT up reply actions
Cool.
I know I’ve teased BYU as much as anybody else, but they’re a part of the MWC family. I’ll give them their due respect for that.
And to be honest, I kinda hope that BYU got their TV deal. I know they want it to advertise their church, but it’s still another outlet to get MWC football on televisions. It may also encourage some sort of reworking of the MWC’s television status. The only downside is that it’d be tougher to get great deals out of ESPN or NBC or someone if the MWC is missing Utah and BYU has their own station.
As a Ute, I shouldn't give a fart about the MWC...
but I still do and I hope nothing but the best for the league. Except, of course, when any MWC team plays Utah or any other Pac member. I guess that’s just the way these things go. It’s an odd thing to go from rooting for the underdog to cheering on the big guy. I spent so long railing against the system and now, here I am, supporting the establishment. Pity the poor Ute fan for his crisis of torn and confused allegiances!
Also, as a Ute fan and a guy who hates horseshit, I hope BYU loses every game they play. But that’s nothing new.
by FeloniousMonk on Aug 25, 2010 9:38 PM PDT up reply actions
I am still anti-bcs
and pro playoff plus am a Utah man.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 25, 2010 9:43 PM PDT up reply actions
Ditto
Putting the MWC into the BCS equation wouldn’t placate my thirst for a playoff.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 25, 2010 9:47 PM PDT up reply actions
Oh, I'm definitely pro-playoff!
But you have to admit that our (Ute fans) views are changing. It’s only natural that we want the Pac to be vindicated as a better league, worthy of its auto-bid and our aspirations. So we have no choice but to cheer for all Pac teams regardless of who they play as it will only make us look better if we beat them and not so bad if we lose to ’em.
by FeloniousMonk on Aug 25, 2010 9:48 PM PDT up reply actions
in that regards it is very true
and I can see some Ute fans be pro BCS just because they are in a BCS league.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 25, 2010 9:49 PM PDT up reply actions
The difference between BYU and Utah
is that Utah’s split isn’t going to be acrimonious, unlike BYU if they leave. Utah made no bones about leaving if the offer came, and no one in the MWC was surprised when it did come and they took it. Most programs probably congratulated Utah for it’s invite because they are going to where we want to be. BYU on the other hand with all the backroom dealing, back stabbing, and lying, leaves a real sour taste in my mouth if they do remain in the MWC. I mean I hated BYU before any of this came to light, so honestly if it didn’t hurt the conference for them to leave I would almost prefer they g.t.f.o. here. I hope the MWC gets an auto-bid, but like most everyone else I’d rather see a playoff for the national title.
I'm still anti-bcs too
But I have to admit that I am begining to believe that they are going to find a way to keep it. I think an alliance between the MWC and C-USA for a shared BCS birth will entrench it so fully that a playoff will never see the light of day. At least not in my life time.
And I'll be happy with either Houston or UTEP.
I kinda like UTEP better simply because they are more culturally attuned to the MWC (and therefore less likely to jump ship later on). But it’s a good decision to have to make either way.
I tend to root for them in bowl games.
That conference pride takes over.
by David Hooper on Aug 25, 2010 8:46 PM PDT up reply actions
umm....
Not ove here.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 25, 2010 9:36 PM PDT up reply actions
I think the only way I’d root for BYU is if they were playing Southern Cal, Oklahoma, Florida, or Clemson. I really hate all 4 of those teams.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 25, 2010 9:38 PM PDT up reply actions
Sour grapes, kids! Sour grapes!
Remember, BYU doesn’t need you or your “cheers” so they won’t appreciate them anyway. BYU is on “another level” from the rest of us and we’re all “holding them back”. They see all the rest of us as boat anchors. Utah, on the other hand, has twice brought your schools BCS bowl windfalls. Also remember that you still have TCU and gain BSU. You don’t need BYU. Piss on ’em, I say.
by FeloniousMonk on Aug 25, 2010 9:57 PM PDT up reply actions
I disagree
The MWC needs BYU since they are a known brand and do carry some national cache. They are the key to a BCS bid.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 25, 2010 10:22 PM PDT up reply actions
I think BYU's cache is all but used up and the MWC have two more important "keys".
This is a “what have you done for me lately” sport. TCU and BSU both currently carry more prestige in the eyes of the BCS than BYU. As it stands right now, BYU is a has-been living off of past glory. That could all change, of course, if BYU makes it to a BCS game or two, but currently, outside of the mountain west region and LDS membership, nobody really cares about BYU. When was the last time BYU was mentioned as a title contender? Ask any average, non-LDS fan around the nation what college stadiums they want see a game in before they die and you’ll hear plenty about South Bend, The Big House, Death Valley, The Rose Bowl, The Horseshoe and even Harvard or The Yale Bowl, but I guarantee that no one will say, “Lavell Edwards Stadium”. That’s what separates real “national programs” from BYU. Sure, they like to think they’re up there, but they’re not.
by FeloniousMonk on Aug 25, 2010 11:08 PM PDT up reply actions
partially agree
They are not a nothing program even over the past few years. They have won at least 10 games since 2006 and not many programs can say that.
What does wanting to see a college game in BYU have to do with their national relevance?
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 25, 2010 11:42 PM PDT up reply actions
While I agree with the idea that the fans have been living in the past
The last several 10 win seasons are a huge boost to the BCS evaluation criteria. They especially help out in the average ranking of all teams catagory.
While it's true that BYU's numbers help, rather than harm, they don't help as much as TCU's
or BSU’s. Yet BYU acts like they’re the top dog in the conference, placing demands and ultimatums, going so far as to view themselves as “saviors”. That just ain’t true when it comes to the way things are currently.
“What does wanting to see a college game in BYU have to do with their national relevance?”
Everything. You said they’re a “known brand and do carry some national cache”. I say they don’t. BYU believes they’re as relevant as Notre Dame or the other big players, but, to the average fan, that’s clearly not true. I know Utah fans who are looking at the Utah-ND game as a chance to finally go to South Bend. How many Ute fans were excited to see Utah play in The Big House? I have friends who desire seeing a Harvard/Yale game. Now, can we say the same about BYU? What Cal fan dreams about coming to Provo? Are there any non-LDS football fans from Texas sitting there with “see a BYU game in Provo, UT” on their bucket lists? Nope, there isn’t. Like I said, that’s the difference.
by FeloniousMonk on Aug 26, 2010 8:24 AM PDT up reply actions
They definately act like a bigger deal than they probably are.
But the truth remains that if the MWC is to have a chance at AQ in 2012, it HAS to have the cougars. Unless somehow the lowbies in the conference are able to pull themselves up to the top 30-40 for the next two years, which I doubt.
I Agree with Both of Your Points
BYU fans live in 1984. And, while they are one of the challenge games on each year’s schedule, “they ain’t what they used to be.”
Still, as things stand today, BYU’s program is vital to Mountain West BCS aspirations in 2012. If Utah had not left, BYU’s leaving would not have a real impact. But with Utah gone, BYU’s presence is a make-or-break part of our conference’s attaining AQ status, just as is TCU’s and Boise’s.
Fear the Frog!
by SammyOBrien on Aug 26, 2010 11:42 AM PDT up reply actions
Yeah, I see your point and acknowledge the truth of it.
It just bothers me that BYU has tried to hold the conference hostage when they’re not even the number #2 most important team in the league. The arrogance of thinking their team is another Notre Dame is especially galling. Utah, TCU, Boise, even a team like Stanford or Oregon hold no such illusions. We know where are teams are, what they are and we enjoy the games. It’s one thing to stare down your nose at “lesser teams” when you are an actual, honest-to-God national powerhouse. Quite another to do so when you’re plainly not.
by FeloniousMonk on Aug 26, 2010 12:00 PM PDT up reply actions
When has anyone from BYU said they thought they were on par with Notre Dame?
I certainly don’t think that. I don’t think wanting to go independent to try to better their situation automatically means they think they’re on the same level as Notre Dame.
I've heard it from BYU grads
That they’re the ‘Mormon Notre Dame.’ Just because you haven’t said it doesn’t mean others haven’t.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 26, 2010 2:16 PM PDT up reply actions
on a minor level
BYU is a religious school and a national following, but very minor compared to Notre Dame.
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 26, 2010 2:57 PM PDT up reply actions
I don’t necessarily think any BYU folks think they’re actually as big or important as Notre Dame – I think they’re trying to say they’re a ‘national’ brand like Notre Dame.
However, in this day and age, there are a lot of non-Notre Dames who are ‘national’ in scope and brand (Texas, Florida, USC, etc.), and a lot of them are bigger brands than BYU.
I also think western-state BYU fans may unintentionally overstate the Cougars’ importance… not realizing that in places like DC, nobody outside of the LDS community talks about them, and even then there are more grads/fans of other schools than there are LDS members/BYU fans.
by VA Libertarian on Aug 26, 2010 3:35 PM PDT up reply actions
Oh, BTW, Dick Harmon is a turd with a fitting first name.
by FeloniousMonk on Aug 25, 2010 9:40 PM PDT reply actions
haha
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by Jeremy Mauss on Aug 25, 2010 9:44 PM PDT up reply actions
Seriously NEVER reference the Dick
Worst journalist bar none in the state. Pretty much count on whatever he says being wrong and you’ll be spot on 9 times out of 10. Which is one of the reasons I’m confident that the Y is coming back home to the MWC.
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