What Is Better For Utah, Staying On Top In Mountain West Or Challenge The Pac-10?
With the recent talk about Utah to the Pac-10 the question to present itself would be: is it better for Utah to stay in the MWC that looks to be on track to becoming a BCS league, or jump to the Pac 10? If Utah stays in the Mountain West and the league becomes the seventh automatic qualifying league it would only be for two years in 2012 and 2013 and not the entire four year cycle. During those years the league would still be evaluated in order to continue their status.
Utah has a choice they could be one of the top teams in the MWC while garnering that extra cash from the BCS bowl games or go to the Pac-10 where they would somewhat struggle for the first f ew years but have the long term financial stability.
Staying in the Mountain West would mean that just winning the league gets them into a big money game even with a loss or two; which would be a long shot as a non-AQ school. However, what real look would they have at the national title game unless they started high in the rankings. Another, reason to be hesitant to stay would be that the BCS would only be guarantying two years of for sure access. So, the league would still have to consistently put a team in the top 10 and multiple in the top 25 to keep that status.
Now, recruiting would get a bump by all the schools -- most importantly the bottom -- which would help elevate the league to keep the BCS status. Just look at Cincinnati it took them only a few years to go from a football nothing in C-USA to two Big East titles. That could happen to Colorado State, UNLV, or San Diego State who have either had great teams or the potential to be great.
Getting back to Utah would it really be better to stay in the Mountain West where they would be the top of the league? They would have an easy time gaining an auto bid because all it would take only to win the league and not have to be perfect. Money would be better then before which is a plus and there is a good chance that their bowl situation would improve with BCS status since teams would be getting better with the additional resources. The Utes could stay and be a threat to win the league each year and perhaps sometimes be in the mix for the national title.
Long term the Pac-10 is a must move for the Utes if they are extended an invite. The reasons start with finances which would be better then the current or even projected money the league would get for being an AQ league. The bowl games are much better and not having to play the bottom of the Pac-10 or another equally disrespected non-AQ school.
The competitive issue to some would seem to be the biggest hurdle to over come for the Utes, because you see they play in the MWC and get the perceived lesser talent. That is not necessarily the case, this past weekend in the NFL Draft the Utes had six players drafted. That was good for a tie with the second most behind USC, Alabama, Florida and Oklahoma, and that was done with two and maybe three star recruits. By moving to the Pac-10 recruits would see that and want to go to Utah where they have a shot at the NFL. Now, that would take maybe two or three years for those players to be solid contributors, but still higher recruits would roll in.
The current Ute team and the one for the following two seasons would be competitive and would have an outside shot at a title. The current notion is that when non-AQ schools play those from AQ schools it is a big one time game that they get up for, but playing week to week they would not last. Utah seems to possibly have separated themselves from that, but are not affected by that. They most likely could be in the upper middle class until the benefits of joining the Pac-10. Also, with USC on a down turn and no real Pac-10 king it would be a perfect time for the Utes to become an instant contender.
Sep. 4 New Mexico WIN
Sep. 11 at Tennessee WIN
Sep. 18 Portland State WIN
Sep. 25 at Arizona State WIN
Oct. 2 Stanford TOSS UP
Oct. 9 at Washington State WIN
Oct. 23 UCLA TOSS UP
Oct. 30 at USC TOSS UP
Nov. 6 Washington WIN
Nov. 13 at California TOSS UP LEANING LOSS
Nov. 20 Arizona TOSS UP
Nov. 27 at Oregon State TOSS UP LEANING LOSS
This could be a bit on the optimistic, and the only two games that would be considered a loss would be at Cal or Oregon State. Obviously Oregon is not on the schedule and that would be a toss up since the game would be at Utah since the 2009 game was in Eugene. Right of the bat Utah could easily be 9-3 in their first year in the Pac-10 if that were in 2010, and even a better record if things go right.
The Utes would be competitive right away even with their current recruiting base which is not as good being in the Mountain West. They would not turn into Washington State overnight, but their first few years would put them in the top half of the league at least until they build up their program even more.
If a decision came down to the Utes to be in the Pac-whatever or an AQ Mountain West league they should make the move for a more stable and better future by leaving the Mountain West.
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Immediate Long Term (If that makes sense) would make more sense but if things go right staying in the MWC might have been the right decision 10 years down the line.
If the MWC is able to gain and hold their BCS AQ through the evaluation periods, by 2016 I think it is the MWC’s TV deal would be up and by then they most certainly could get a better TV Deal and like you said, with the BCS Money, all thosse teams at the bottom of the conference could get a lot better and competition could be better. It really just depends on if Utah is thinking optimistically in the sense that they think the MWC will still have a BCS AQ by 2017. If they think they won’t, then it makes more sense.
So what I guess the answer really comes down to is how optimistic the Utah board of directors really are.
UNLV is going all the way this year!
The footprint of the MWC can't compare with the Pac-10's
therefore the TV deal will never be able to compete fully.
The MWC has a presence in the 5th (TCU-DFW), 16th (AF/CSU-Denver) 28th (SDSU-San Deigo) and 31st (UU/BYU-SLC) and then there is a steep drop off. Also, giving the MWC Denver is a bit of a stretch since both Fort Collins and Colorado Springs are both 50 miles outside Denver proper. Those numbers could be respectable but I think that will be what ultimately holds the MWC back from acheiving elite conference status.
Big-10: 5 top 30 markets
Big-12: 4 top 30 markets (controls Texas and the plains)
Big East: 5 top 30 markets
ACC: 5 top 30 markets
SEC: 2 top 30 markets
Pac-10: 5 top 30 markets (with complete market saturation having 2 teams in each).
MWC: 4 top 30 markets (I’ll throw SLC a bone since a couple of the others were a stretch)
The SEC was overpaid based purely on repuation and ratings. ESPN was desperate to push an agenda (and the SEC has proven ratings nationwide) and frankly since their channels are all cable, they are seen on all the sets in the SE no matter if the team has a footprint in the metro area or not.
Should the MWC strike up a very lucrative deal with a cable network, it could happen. The best bet they have is to wait out the Versus deal and see if the Comcast/Universal merger goes through so that they have the inside route on what would be NBC’s cable sports challenge to ESPN. No non-cable network is going to be willing to push MWC games out there in front of Pac-10 or Big-12 games when both can reach more sets.
Expansion into other markets along with the BCS AQ status could get them over the hump. BSU and Houston could fill both roles (adding Houston metro and BSU helping to get the BCS status).
Utah would be better served in both the short term (since the Pac-10 splits revenue evenly and the TV deal is up in 2012) and long term (more TV’s means more money in the TV contract) to join the Pac-10. Either way with the way things are shaking out in the MWC they’re in a good spot. Big fish in a small pond (with the spectre of growth) or small average fish in a big pond, they can’t really lose unless the MWC gets absolutely raided by the expansion bug.
Now, this gives Craig Thompson a reason to expand to 12
Like you said, now with Utah threatening to leave we have to show that we will have big media markets to make the TV deal much better in 2016 and therefore maybe par with the Pac-10 in terms of money. That way Utah has some incentive to stay.
UNLV is going all the way this year!
agreed. craig thompson needs to be pro active. make a move before anybody else does.
remember it only takes one team in the pac-ten to say no. i could see stanford saying no b/c they would not think utah is up to their academic standards and i could see usc saying no b/c if they run the table they will play in the bcs ncg b/c of tradition, most of the time it would be an east coast/ west coast battle and they have 38 million people in the state which translates into viewership numbers. i say goto 12 and we have proven we can beat the pac-ten head to head and just keep beating the chumps who think they are superior. peace.
I'm all about covering the spread and moneylines. I was building a house, I don't deserve this, deserves have nothing to do with it. Bang. "Unforgiven" I drink your milkshake. I drink it up! "There Will BE Blood". Hell is just a word, the reality is much much worse." Event Horizon". Now remember, when things look bad and it looks like you're not gonna make it, then you gotta get mean, I mean plumb, mad dog mean. cause if you lose your head and you give up then you neither live or win. That's just the way it is. "The Outlaw Josey Wales".
by wolfmanshowlforever on Apr 27, 2010 10:31 AM PDT up reply actions
As a Ute fan, Here's my take:
I ultimately think in the long run, The PAC-10 is the better option. Although it’s true , staying put in the MWC and inviting teams such as Boise St. and Fresno St. woud grant the MWC BCS status, I think more could be accomplished by taking the pac-10 road.
Because I’m a realist, I agree Utah’s first few years would be a bumpy but in the end the reward would be worth it. As it stands now, Utah is one of the best non-aq teams in terms of recruiting. Furthermore, Utah has indeed proven it can send talent to the NFL. I have no doubt that a move to the Pac-10 could open avenues not only in financail terms but in recruiting as well. I’m sure when (and if) Utah gained Pac-10 status, we would see more four star (and Maybe even the ocassional five star ) players come here for the sole reason that the pac-10 offers great competition and gives them great TV exposure. Loads of people complained that no one saw Utah play in 08’, thus they didn’t deserve a shot at the title. A move to the Pac-10 would easily fix this problem. (but of course it could be a double edged sword if Utah struggled to fit in the Pac-10). In short, Utah would make leaps in recruiting overnight. Even though one could agrue the same could happen if the MWC were to gain BCS status, I think the naysayers would take Utah more seriously for a title game if they were to go undefeated in the Pac-10 instead of a revised MWC.
As much as I hate to say it, the MWC will take time to convince the voters that it would be on the same level as other BCS conferences. Even with heavy hitters like TCU, BSU and BYU, voters would be more inclined to reward a team that beat “elite” teams like USC and Oregon (or any other Pac-10 team that has an up year). I now that’s unfair but this is the BCS were talking about; Fair and BCS don’t even belong in the same sentence.
On top?
Where is this “Utah on top of the MWC” coming from?
In the 5 years since Meyer Quit, KWitt’s teams are:
2005 MWC 4th
2006 MWC 3rd
2007 MWC 4th
2008 MWC 1st
2009 MWC 3rd
Average: 3
During that same time BYU is:
2005 MWC 2nd
2006 MWC 1st
2007 MWC 1st
2008 MWC 3rd
2009 MWC 2nd
Average: 1.8
And TCU is:
2005 MWC 1st
2006 MWC 2nd
2007 MWC 5th
2008 MWC 2nd
2009 MWC 1st
Average 2.2
Both TCU and BYU are stronger in the MWC over the past 5 years than Utah under KWitt.
Source: mwc.com
by Some_Perspective on Apr 28, 2010 3:24 PM PDT reply actions
I think he was implying that Utah is in the upper tier of teams in the MWC every year
and they can compete for the conference title and a BCS berth. That won’t happen in the Pac-10 right away.
Nice of you to read nothing but the title, then join specifically to nitpick.
Just some perspective
I read the article, which is why I did the research on results. I just don’t agree that top 3 makes you the best expansion team from a conference. I certainly wouldn’t want the MWC to expand by taking the #3 WAC team. Would love to have Boise State for football.
I also know the PAC10 is not looking only at results. Of the MWC and WAC teams Utah is the closest fit to the PAC10 profile.
The whole thing will domino if the Big 10 expands all the way to 16 teams, then who knows what will happen.
by Some_Perspective on Apr 28, 2010 4:18 PM PDT up reply actions
Utah is on top of the MWC
They are a threat each year to win the league, even this past year in a rebuilding phrase they won 10 games and were at the top of the MWC. I was not declaring them the best team in the MWC, and that 2005 year was an anomaly with all the defection to the NFL draft, graduation, and a new coach.
Utah would be a threat within 3 years of being in the Pac-10 and before then would be at worst an 8 win team in the new league.
by Jeremy Mauss on May 1, 2010 12:47 PM PDT up reply actions
byu zero bcs bowl games. utah 2 bcs bowl games and 1 was with coach whitt and we beat bama
in their backyard. still the best win over any of the teams that have played aq bcs teams in any bowl game. also 1 undefeated season under coach whitt. bronco mendenhall’s quest for perfection: a joke. plus this year utah will win 11 or 12 games. byu even with unga maybe 8 wins. case closed.
I'm all about covering the spread and moneylines. I was building a house, I don't deserve this, deserves have nothing to do with it. Bang. "Unforgiven" I drink your milkshake. I drink it up! "There Will BE Blood". Hell is just a word, the reality is much much worse." Event Horizon". Now remember, when things look bad and it looks like you're not gonna make it, then you gotta get mean, I mean plumb, mad dog mean. cause if you lose your head and you give up then you neither live or win. That's just the way it is. "The Outlaw Josey Wales".
by wolfmanshowlforever on Apr 29, 2010 12:59 PM PDT up reply actions

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